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STUDY GROUP WEEK 2
JDOG1645
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July 25, 2010 - 10:50 am
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This HH is from tmck21.  Its on absolute so remember you have to choose absolute when you convert the HH.  Its 126 hands so depending on how it goes we may add another HH earlier than Sunday.  I didnt see any notes so  tmck21 if you wanna comment on anything about the HH I will add it to this thread.

 

$10 +1

 

…..k21_3K.txt

JDOG1645
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July 26, 2010 - 10:25 am
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I will have my review up in the next day or so…lets get going on this one guys.

tmck21
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July 26, 2010 - 1:37 pm
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hey, didn't have any real reads on anyone. hadn't played with any previously.

dawhiteninja
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July 26, 2010 - 2:57 pm
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what software should I download to view these, please? All HH reviewers I search for are online.

pedactor
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July 26, 2010 - 3:27 pm
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Hand 4: I lead out on this flop. Way to draw heavy and with top 2 it's still +ev to fire out and make the draws pay. If river comes and A or K….do we lay this down?

 

Hand 34: You could open this, even with the limper behind. Just fold if he 3 bets. Limping is fine too I suppose, but I just don't like limping.

 

Hand 36: Now here is a spot I think i would like to get some discussion on. You have stacks behind you that are in the re-shove range. In the lower limits, do we take this into consideration or not? I have been….and I think it's made me too nitty. You mentioned no reads, so do we default to what we know is the play to do based on stack sizes?

 

Hand 44: I think I raise him on the turn here. The bet looks fishy, so either trying to milk you or putting out a blocker bet. If i'm willing to call here, and possibly call a small river bet, then I would rather raise to about 900 here and fold to any more aggression.

 

Hand 50 or 51: Can't see it on the replayer?? but you seem to lose half your stack on it.

 

Hand 52: Borderline hand with with 12 bb, but if you are going to open, then just shove it in. Thoughts from others on the shove range here?

 

Hand 57: Shove the sb limp here.

 

Hand 58: Shove your sb…or at least raise and then shove any flop….but I prefer shove pre flop.

 

Hand 71: Ship it pre.

 

Hand 79: You have 44 with 8 bb. 5 people to get through…..hmmm….don't know….I think it's a shove  here??

 

Hand 83: I think this is a shove with almost any 2.

 

Hand 86: I'm noticing your raising hands instead of shoving, which is cool if you are basically trying to induce someone to come along….but at this point I would rather just pick up the blinds uncontested with a hand like 88. What if the flop comes A T 4….puts you in a crappy position.

 

Hand 92: Auto shove

 

Hand 95: Need someone to run the numbers on this….profitable to go in with KT or not??

 

Hand 102: Don't like the open here. You have a big stack next to you, and a small stack you are committed to next to him. Once he calls, he has a very strong hand or is just an idiot. As played, you could have decreased your open amount a bit….less chips in case big stack decides to shove. No point continuation better here as he's committed.

 

Hand 106: As mentioned above,  I think you should just stay consistant and shove at this point. In this case you want people to come along, and a shove looks weaker.

 

Hand 108: SHIP!

 

Hand 109: Ship Pre….as played, shove flop.

 

Hand 126: Shove Pre…. Villain might have laid that 68s down

 

Hope this was worth while. I know most of it focused on pre-flop play but you were pretty much playing very shallow stack the whole time.

jhammond10
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July 26, 2010 - 4:01 pm
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HAND NO                                 NOTE

4                                  I like a lead here 3 ways, esp since the PF aggressor's stack to pot ratio is so low.

57                                 Shove Pre

58                                 Shove

92                                 Shove

95                                 Close I think, but I'm shoving here vs most tables

102                               Once you decided to raise pre (I prob fold the 78), you are not folding to the BB at any point… ESPECIALLY after you CB giving yourself 12:1

 

108                               ???? Shoving for sure

109                               Jamming here too.  I would std raise or min raise if I wanted action, but I am happy to take it down pre with AJ.

112                               I fold here.  Don't like raise folding this stack, and raise calling is a disaster.  Save what FE you have left.

126                               Same as 109.  I would be happy to take the 2k in the middle with 77 here W/o showdown. Jam it in.  Sick flop though 🙁

 

There were a few hands (6 or so) that didn't show up in my replayer for whatever reason.  edit: Pedactor beat me to it about the missing hands.  Anyone know why they didn't show up?

tmck21
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July 26, 2010 - 5:28 pm
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pedactor said:

Hand 4: I lead out on this flop. Way to draw heavy and with top 2 it's still +ev to fire out and make the draws pay. If river comes and A or K….do we lay this down?

 

Hand 34: You could open this, even with the limper behind. Just fold if he 3 bets. Limping is fine too I suppose, but I just don't like limping.

 

Hand 36: Now here is a spot I think i would like to get some discussion on. You have stacks behind you that are in the re-shove range. In the lower limits, do we take this into consideration or not? I have been….and I think it's made me too nitty. You mentioned no reads, so do we default to what we know is the play to do based on stack sizes?

 i have been trying to make the right due to stack sizes and like you also makes me look like a nit. it sucks. any cure?

Hand 44: I think I raise him on the turn here. The bet looks fishy, so either trying to milk you or putting out a blocker bet. If i'm willing to call here, and possibly call a small river bet, then I would rather raise to about 900 here and fold to any more aggression.

 ok, i do need to be more aggressive.

Hand 50 or 51: Can't see it on the replayer?? but you seem to lose half your stack on it.

 didn't process i guess, i couldn't find it on site

Hand 52: Borderline hand with with 12 bb, but if you are going to open, then just shove it in. Thoughts from others on the shove range here?

 yep

Hand 57: Shove the sb limp here.

 

Hand 58: Shove your sb…or at least raise and then shove any flop….but I prefer shove pre flop.

 again, playing too timid

Hand 71: Ship it pre.

 

Hand 79: You have 44 with 8 bb. 5 people to get through…..hmmm….don't know….I think it's a shove  here??

 seems like i would be too far away

Hand 83: I think this is a shove with almost any 2.

 yeah i can see that now.

Hand 86: I'm noticing your raising hands instead of shoving, which is cool if you are basically trying to induce someone to come along….but at this point I would rather just pick up the blinds uncontested with a hand like 88. What if the flop comes A T 4….puts you in a crappy position.

 yep, been watching panda lately and learning the when to shove

Hand 92: Auto shove

 

Hand 95: Need someone to run the numbers on this….profitable to go in with KT or not??

 

Hand 102: Don't like the open here. You have a big stack next to you, and a small stack you are committed to next to him. Once he calls, he has a very strong hand or is just an idiot. As played, you could have decreased your open amount a bit….less chips in case big stack decides to shove. No point continuation better here as he's committed.

 good point.

Hand 106: As mentioned above,  I think you should just stay consistant and shove at this point. In this case you want people to come along, and a shove looks weaker.

 

Hand 108: SHIP!

 

Hand 109: Ship Pre….as played, shove flop.

 

Hand 126: Shove Pre…. Villain might have laid that 68s down

Hope this was worth while. I know most of it focused on pre-flop play but you were pretty much playing very shallow stack the whole time.

yes, very much so.thanks.


tmck21
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July 26, 2010 - 5:36 pm
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jhammond10 said:

HAND NO                                 NOTE

4                                  I like a lead here 3 ways, esp since the PF aggressor's stack to pot ratio is so low.

57                                 Shove Pre

58                                 Shove

92                                 Shove

95                                 Close I think, but I'm shoving here vs most tables

102                               Once you decided to raise pre (I prob fold the 78), you are not folding to the BB at any point… ESPECIALLY after you CB giving yourself 12:1

 

108                               ???? Shoving for sure

109                               Jamming here too.  I would std raise or min raise if I wanted action, but I am happy to take it down pre with AJ.

112                               I fold here.  Don't like raise folding this stack, and raise calling is a disaster.  Save what FE you have left.

126                               Same as 109.  I would be happy to take the 2k in the middle with 77 here W/o showdown. Jam it in.  Sick flop though 🙁

 

There were a few hands (6 or so) that didn't show up in my replayer for whatever reason.  edit: Pedactor beat me to it about the missing hands.  Anyone know why they didn't show up?


 thank you. i couldn't find them in the files on ap either.

JDOG1645
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July 27, 2010 - 12:33 am
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dawhiteninja said:

what software should I download to view these, please? All HH reviewers I search for are online.


Popopop's universal replayer…its what you see the pros use in their vids.

JDOG1645
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July 27, 2010 - 1:10 am
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Havent had time to go back and read others posts but here is my two cents. Later this week I will go back and comment on other posts.

 

4 JTs – bet this flop every time, it will connect with a lot of the other players ranges and we dont want to give free cards nor do we want to lose a spot to get value.

5 A3s- well played I play it exactly the same.

9 QJs – good laydown

10 QTo – limped around 400 dead in the pot, whats your read on the initial limper.  I think based on their stack sizes we could have possible 3bet here..thoughts?

14  AQo – no doubt  we arent folding but by flatting whats your plan if the BB now ships?  I probably would have tried to isolate.

24 A8o – Nice bet sizing.

 34 A9s- I dont mind the flat against the big stack IP. Althought the SB is so short he could ship there and reopen the action.

36 T9s – not sure if I would open that in the Hi-jack +1 also keep in mind Im not worried about the cutoff super short stack but the BB has a perfect stack size to 3bet shove. As played cbet 100%.

38 55- folding is fine imo with 2 short stacks behind.

44 AJs- I think you have to call that river there is just way too much in the pot. You have never shown any hand strength and this guy min bets down your A high could be good against something like KTs with a busted flush draw, your just getting a super sick price and you would have to be correct 1 out of 11 times.

 57 A8o- your super short stacked SB limps in your probably ahead of his range, shove it and let the hand play itself.

 58 KJs- folded to us in the Sb with 11 Bb behind insta jam every day dont limp here.

71 66- we arent getting away from our hand by that raise so it should be a jam because if we arent getting away from our hand let him get it in when we are probably ahead rather than we call it off when we are behind.

 79 44- is very close there like to hear what others think.

 80 AJo- again just jam it pre.

 83 45o- Sb vs BB  we are under 10 BB whats our read on him, we have enough chips to hurt his stack I think we need to ship, we are probably not dominated if he calls.

86  88- again jam…your giving reads by jamming some hands and simply raising others when your stack is around the 10-13BB range, someone may pick up on your hand strength by your opening sizes.

 92 QT- Sb vs Bb again you should be jamming this every day.

 95 KTo – in the high jack folded to you, thats a ship imo.

 106 AK- jam

108 33- Sb vs BB folded to you with like 8 BB you have 33 this is a jam

 109  AJo – folded to us on button you raised with under 10 BB …this is a jam.

112 A5s – if you know your not getting away from any Axx flop then jam A5s has more value then simply the A obviously.

 

Ok not a bad tourney but I see two major issues:

playing  BB vs SB  we played this far to passive imo

bet sizing we are raising sometimes and jamming others. We want our bets to be standard, we want to be jamming all the time around 10BB, it gives us FE and we do it witrh monsters, medium strength and air we are unexploitable.

lespaulgman
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July 27, 2010 - 9:58 pm
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Hand 4 — Not sure I am calling a raise this early in a tourney out of the BB. I know JTs flops well (and it did in this case) but I am not sure that I would be playing OOP with it at this point.
Hand 9 — Don't hate the open, sucks you got 3bet.
Hand 14 — Why just flat the all-in? With AQo I would much rather play Heads Up than a multiway pot and just flatting leaves it awful enticing for the BB to come along. He is getting pretty good odds to call and he may shove to isolate putting you back in a weird spot.
Hand 34 — not sure I am in love with the limp behind with the A9s. I am probably just folding this. I know you have position, but I am not sure I like it enough to raise as it looks a lot like a steal from the Hijack and things are worth getting into dicey spots with. I just fold this guy and wait till the next hand.
Hand 38 — Not sure I would fold pocket 5s here. I would open them. I am pretty sure the A8o wouldn't have come along, but you would have had the KK jam on you and I would have folded annoyed, but at the very least I would have opened it up. UTG+1 can make it look a little bigger and buy you some credibility, especially if an Ace drops on the flop and you get to see it, may cause the kings to get nervous and fold (not sure how that would have worked, but it may have).
Hand 44 — Sticky spot here. I am leaning towards wanting to shove to isolate the all-in player. There are a bunch to act behind you and it is a bit of a risk, but I don't think a standard raise is going to chase away marginal hands looking to play with the ATC all-in on this one. AJs is vulnerable multi-way. You raised pre-flop so I am not sure I like calling (especially all the way down with air here). I would take a shot at reraising him here and see if you can make him think about his hand. If he calls, re-evaluate the turn.
Hand 57 — I am not sure I raise the SB lead here. Blinds can have ATC so putting him on a range is pretty much impossible so you have no real way to determine how hard he connected with the flop. I think raising him is an unnessecary risk in this situation. If you had connected with the flop then stay, but having nothing but air this line feels like a risk not worth taking.
Hand 58,92,100, 106, 108 — You have 20bb effective, I would be shoving here BvB. You are giving away to much value here by not.
Hand 71,80,86, 112 — Raising here borders on being pretty clowny. You are sub 10bb, shove or fold, you really don't have the ability to play post-flop so if you are going to play, ship it.
Hand 79 — I think folding the 44 here given your stack is pretty weak. I think you can shove this from MP. 
As a note by hand 102 you are starting to get pretty exploitable in my opinion. When you are opening you are playing your weaker hands and you are only shoving your stronger ones. Gotta watch out for this tendency.
Hand 102 — Not sure I would have played this hand at all like this. Your stack is really not big enough for the kind of play your trying for here. You are pretty much a shove or fold stack so trying to C-Bet this flop, which stands a pretty good chance of hitting your opponent pretty hard is going to be just costing you chips and you can't really afford to give them away
Hand 109 — Gotta shove this Pre-flop. In this case when he checks to you twice I would shove when I connect with the Jack. I think this hand just went way to passive.
Hand 123 — Not sure I fold a PP this short, I would shove.
Last Hand — gotta shove this too. I think by the end you we incurring a lot of calls because you were so short. I think if you plug that you should see a distinct improvement in results. This is my two cents for now…
tmck21
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July 28, 2010 - 12:02 am
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JDOG1645 said:

Havent had time to go back and read others posts but here is my two cents. Later this week I will go back and comment on other posts.

 

4 JTs – bet this flop every time, it will connect with a lot of the other players ranges and we dont want to give free cards nor do we want to lose a spot to get value.

5 A3s- well played I play it exactly the same.

9 QJs – good laydown

10 QTo – limped around 400 dead in the pot, whats your read on the initial limper.  I think based on their stack sizes we could have possible 3bet here..thoughts?  never a thought, as you can tell i  am a bit passive

14  AQo – no doubt  we arent folding but by flatting whats your plan if the BB now ships?  I probably would have tried to isolate.  i worry about bb waking up with hand and now i'm allin. i probably call shove but hate it

24 A8o – Nice bet sizing.

 34 A9s- I dont mind the flat against the big stack IP. Althought the SB is so short he could ship there and reopen the action.

36 T9s – not sure if I would open that in the Hi-jack +1 also keep in mind Im not worried about the cutoff super short stack but the BB has a perfect stack size to 3bet shove. As played cbet 100%. yeah, a bit far away

38 55- folding is fine imo with 2 short stacks behind.

44 AJs- I think you have to call that river there is just way too much in the pot. You have never shown any hand strength and this guy min bets down your A high could be good against something like KTs with a busted flush draw, your just getting a super sick price and you would have to be correct 1 out of 11 times.

 57 A8o- your super short stacked SB limps in your probably ahead of his range, shove it and let the hand play itself.

 58 KJs- folded to us in the Sb with 11 Bb behind insta jam every day dont limp here.

71 66- we arent getting away from our hand by that raise so it should be a jam because if we arent getting away from our hand let him get it in when we are probably ahead rather than we call it off when we are behind.

 79 44- is very close there like to hear what others think.

 80 AJo- again just jam it pre.

 83 45o- Sb vs BB  we are under 10 BB whats our read on him, we have enough chips to hurt his stack I think we need to ship, we are probably not dominated if he calls.

86  88- again jam…your giving reads by jamming some hands and simply raising others when your stack is around the 10-13BB range, someone may pick up on your hand strength by your opening sizes.

 92 QT- Sb vs Bb again you should be jamming this every day.

 95 KTo – in the high jack folded to you, thats a ship imo.

 106 AK- jam

108 33- Sb vs BB folded to you with like 8 BB you have 33 this is a jam

 109  AJo – folded to us on button you raised with under 10 BB …this is a jam.

112 A5s – if you know your not getting away from any Axx flop then jam A5s has more value then simply the A obviously.

 

Ok not a bad tourney but I see two major issues:

playing  BB vs SB  we played this far to passive imo

bet sizing we are raising sometimes and jamming others. We want our bets to be standard, we want to be jamming all the time around 10BB, it gives us FE and we do it witrh monsters, medium strength and air we are unexploitable.

thanks jdog. i hadn't realized the bet sizing thing.


tmck21
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July 28, 2010 - 12:21 am
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lespaulgman said:

Hand 4 — Not sure I am calling a raise this early in a tourney out of the BB. I know JTs flops well (and it did in this case) but I am not sure that I would be playing OOP with it at this point.
Hand 9 — Don't hate the open, sucks you got 3bet.
Hand 14 — Why just flat the all-in? With AQo I would much rather play Heads Up than a multiway pot and just flatting leaves it awful enticing for the BB to come along. He is getting pretty good odds to call and he may shove to isolate putting you back in a weird spot.
Hand 34 — not sure I am in love with the limp behind with the A9s. I am probably just folding this. I know you have position, but I am not sure I like it enough to raise as it looks a lot like a steal from the Hijack and things are worth getting into dicey spots with. I just fold this guy and wait till the next hand.
Hand 38 — Not sure I would fold pocket 5s here. I would open them. I am pretty sure the A8o wouldn't have come along, but you would have had the KK jam on you and I would have folded annoyed, but at the very least I would have opened it up. UTG+1 can make it look a little bigger and buy you some credibility, especially if an Ace drops on the flop and you get to see it, may cause the kings to get nervous and fold (not sure how that would have worked, but it may have).
Hand 44 — Sticky spot here. I am leaning towards wanting to shove to isolate the all-in player. There are a bunch to act behind you and it is a bit of a risk, but I don't think a standard raise is going to chase away marginal hands looking to play with the ATC all-in on this one. AJs is vulnerable multi-way. You raised pre-flop so I am not sure I like calling (especially all the way down with air here). I would take a shot at reraising him here and see if you can make him think about his hand. If he calls, re-evaluate the turn. yep, shoulda raised flop and then i would have known where i was.
Hand 57 — I am not sure I raise the SB lead here. Blinds can have ATC so putting him on a range is pretty much impossible so you have no real way to determine how hard he connected with the flop. I think raising him is an unnessecary risk in this situation. If you had connected with the flop then stay, but having nothing but air this line feels like a risk not worth taking.
Hand 58,92,100, 106, 108 — You have 20bb effective, I would be shoving here BvB. You are giving away to much value here by not.
Hand 71,80,86, 112 — Raising here borders on being pretty clowny. You are sub 10bb, shove or fold, you really don't have the ability to play post-flop so if you are going to play, ship it. yeah, i can see that now and have adjusted.
Hand 79 — I think folding the 44 here given your stack is pretty weak. I think you can shove this from MP. 
As a note by hand 102 you are starting to get pretty exploitable in my opinion. When you are opening you are playing your weaker hands and you are only shoving your stronger ones. Gotta watch out for this tendency.
Hand 102 — Not sure I would have played this hand at all like this. Your stack is really not big enough for the kind of play your trying for here. You are pretty much a shove or fold stack so trying to C-Bet this flop, which stands a pretty good chance of hitting your opponent pretty hard is going to be just costing you chips and you can't really afford to give them away
Hand 109 — Gotta shove this Pre-flop. In this case when he checks to you twice I would shove when I connect with the Jack. I think this hand just went way to passive.
Hand 123 — Not sure I fold a PP this short, I would shove.
Last Hand — gotta shove this too. I think by the end you we incurring a lot of calls because you were so short. I think if you plug that you should see a distinct improvement in results. This is my two cents for now…

thanks a bunch. definetly have a recurring theme (passive) and will be working on this. appreciate the time.


JDOG1645
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July 28, 2010 - 10:29 am
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As I read over this thread I notice we are all saying a lot of similar things which means we all think similar about poker.  There are some minor difference on some hands but we all seem to think that tmck21 should be jamming more late and not just raising some and jamming others and that limping the blinds is a bad thing.  I think overall tmck21 played pretty good and with some tweaks to his game should go even further.  I hope everyone is finding the group useful and fun.   If you  have any comments please PM on how to make the group better. As I anticipated a lot of  people would be interested but only a handful will follow through with being involved. To those that do may you reap the reward Cool

lespaulgman
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July 28, 2010 - 10:40 am
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I think this is a phenomenal activity. As with anything in life you are going to get out what you put in. If we only have a small group that is reading and contributing then so be it, if it forces us to think and improve our game then it is worth it. If nothing else for those who just casually read the threads maybe it will help them to see what people think about different situations. I am really looking forward to this as a continuing activity. I have been saving several hand histories and I am looking forward to what the group thinks about my play at some point.

pedactor
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July 28, 2010 - 1:39 pm
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+1. ROCK N' ROLL!!

tmck21
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July 29, 2010 - 6:32 pm
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hey folks, thanks for the reviews. much appreciated.Smile

lespaulgman
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July 29, 2010 - 9:25 pm
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Always glad to share my thoughts. I find it hard since I don't have an opportunity to discuss hands and play with anyone live since I don't know anyone in my area who is as serious about getting better as I am so this is a great outlet!

mistergj
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July 31, 2010 - 8:29 am
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Hand 4 (JTs): Did you have any stats on these players? Is OR likely to cbet? If he is then I like the check/raise here. If not then I definitely lead about c. 350 On the turn I like the flat since SB could be betting a 9 here (or KQ if he was looking to check/raise on the flop). On the river I think I raise more to like 1200 as there are so many hands that will call like Jx, Tx, 9x, 87, KQ.

 

Hand 9 (QJs): The BB has less than 10 BBs and the average stack behind you is 30BB so I think you can raise to 2.5x since you're committed to calling the BBs shove (and the CO), but probably won't put any more chips in if you are raised by anyone else.

 

Hand 18 (77): Again I would make it 2.5x pre, and the big stacks are in the blinds so you will have position on them post flop.

 

Hand 24 (A8o): Again I make it 2.5x to save yourself chips if SB wakes up with a hand and yet still committing yourself to a BB shove.

 

Hand 34 (A9s): I would definitely isoraise the limper. I would have opened the pot from here with this hand so am going to do the same with a limper. I make it 525 (2.5x +1BB).

 

Hand 35 (T9s): I like the pf raise size (!) :-). Do you have BB down as a weak player? Cos flatting here with 15BB is just horrible unless he has a big hand. When he checks I think you can make your cbet smaller just in case he is hiding that big hand. If you make it 550-600 he's still going to fold the hands that haven't connected and shove those that have and you save yourself 150-200 chips.

 

Hand 44 (AJs): I make it much more here to prevent calls behind and get utg limp heads-up. Again I make it 2.5x +1BB so 700. The original limper likes to limp a lot so when he donks it just screams weakness. I definitely raise the donk to about 1000 and then shut down if he calls – this might be a bit of a spew and open us up to some bluffs on the river if we check behind the turn and say the flush doesn't hit and the BB leads out – do we call? This hand, and spots like it, cause me a headache!!! Looking at the hand he showed down I wonder if we can get him off it…

 

Hand 52 (97s): With antes and only 12BB this is a shove or fold spot. The 2.5x raise might look really strong to some players, but will get you in trouble vs weak ones. From this spot I'm shoving… 22+, any Ace, KTo+, K7s+, QTo+, Q8s+, JTo, J8s+, T8s+, 97s+, 87s, 76s so basically any broadway, any ace, any pair and then suited connectors and 2 gappers with a picture card. So this is a shove! When the SB raises you're getting 37%, which almost prices you in to a call. However, he is repping massive strength considering you're raise 2.5x on a 12BB stack with antes.

 

Hand 57 (A8o): Does SB limp a lot? I think I shove here as there are so many horrible flops when we stand to have the best hand pre considering his limp. As played I'm not sure I can comment on the flop raise.

 

Hand 58 (KJs): Again with 12BB with antes your range for shoving from the SB vs BB should be huge and KJs is right at the top of that range. I think you should be shoving any two card that aren't horrible, like 92o. So definitely shove here. 

 

Hand 67 (Q8o): With less than 10BB and an M of 4 you can't limp the SB here. You are in shove/fold mode and need to preserve your stack to maximise your fold equity. By limping here you're suddenly down to 9BB.

 

Hand 71 (66): This is a tough spot as the utg limper has a biggish stack and you probably won't be able to get him to fold. However, in this spot when you're getting pretty desperate I think you just have to shove and pray to win a flip. Not to be results oriented, but if you shove I'm sure utg calls and then you double up to 20BB where you have more room to maneuver as opposed to the 14BB you're left with and still in push/fold mode.

 

Hand 79 (44): With 8BB and an M of 3 you are really searching for any playable hand and 44 is way good enough to get it in here. You only have a few hands before the blinds hit you again when you lose all fold equity. 

 

Hand 83 (54o): I think this is a shove. You have more than enough chips to damage BB's stack and 54o isn't THAT bad when called. What sort of range would you put BB on to call you here? I think it would be pretty tight, something like 22+,ATs+,KJs+,QJs,JTs,ATo+,KQo (12.8%) which you have 30.8% equity against. This means 87.2% of the time you will win 1050 chips uncontested (915). When he does call you will win 30.8% of the time so 12.8%*30.8%*7736 (the total pot if you shove and he calls) = 399. This is a cEV of 1314. (Can someone check the Maths on this please – my head hurts).

 

Hand 86 (88): Just shove. Hands that might call your 11BB shove like 55 are definitely going to fold to your pfr. Also if you just shove your weaker hands (like the A5s) and raise your bigger hands like 88 then you will soon be exploitable. 

 

Hand 92 (QTo): This is a shove again as this time you have much more equity against his calling range and there is more to be won. 

 

Hand 95 (KTo): This is a shove as well. Broadway hands are great to get all in with a short stack, although I'd like someone to tell me why (?). None of the stacks behind you will be able to call without a strong hand and you will probably take the pot down a huge percentage of the time. 

 

Hand 100 (J6o): This might be close to a shove when the SB limps. He'll definitely need a strong hand to call after limping. I'd like others' thought on this. What's our range for shoving here? Again I don't think I can comment on the BvsB play as I'm horrendous! I don't think you should bet the turn though as your hand has showdown value, albeit very weak sdv.

 

Hand 102 (87o): I think this is quite close to being a shove. How close are we to the money bubble? Has it already passed? I think if we are close to the bubble then this is a shove. Again, thoughts from others gratefully received.

 

Hand 106 (AKo): Again just shove as you're making it obvious you have a big hand by raising.

 

Hand 108 (33): Definite shove.

 

Hand 109 (AJo): Definitely shove again rather than raising. By opening you open yourself up to flats and then will be put in gross spots post. Just shove.

 

Hand 111 (A4o): I think this is a shove, although maybe that's a bit loose. You have a lot of fold equity against the majority of the players behind you who will all need a really strong hand to call.

 

Hand 112 (A5s): This is a shove.

 

Hand 123 (22): This is a shove. Again, you're looking for any playable hand while you still have FE. 

 

Hand 126 (77): Shove! Gross way to end a tournament. GG.

tmck21
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July 31, 2010 - 9:52 pm
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lespaulgman said:

Always glad to share my thoughts. I find it hard since I don't have an opportunity to discuss hands and play with anyone live since I don't know anyone in my area who is as serious about getting better as I am so this is a great outlet!


 

+1Cool

tmck21
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mistergj said:

Hand 4 (JTs): Did you have any stats on these players? Is OR likely to cbet? If he is then I like the check/raise here. If not then I definitely lead about c. 350 On the turn I like the flat since SB could be betting a 9 here (or KQ if he was looking to check/raise on the flop). On the river I think I raise more to like 1200 as there are so many hands that will call like Jx, Tx, 9x, 87, KQ.

 

Hand 9 (QJs): The BB has less than 10 BBs and the average stack behind you is 30BB so I think you can raise to 2.5x since you're committed to calling the BBs shove (and the CO), but probably won't put any more chips in if you are raised by anyone else.

 

Hand 18 (77): Again I would make it 2.5x pre, and the big stacks are in the blinds so you will have position on them post flop.

 

Hand 24 (A8o): Again I make it 2.5x to save yourself chips if SB wakes up with a hand and yet still committing yourself to a BB shove.

 

Hand 34 (A9s): I would definitely isoraise the limper. I would have opened the pot from here with this hand so am going to do the same with a limper. I make it 525 (2.5x +1BB).

 

Hand 35 (T9s): I like the pf raise size (!) :-). Do you have BB down as a weak player? Cos flatting here with 15BB is just horrible unless he has a big hand. When he checks I think you can make your cbet smaller just in case he is hiding that big hand. If you make it 550-600 he's still going to fold the hands that haven't connected and shove those that have and you save yourself 150-200 chips.

 

Hand 44 (AJs): I make it much more here to prevent calls behind and get utg limp heads-up. Again I make it 2.5x +1BB so 700. The original limper likes to limp a lot so when he donks it just screams weakness. I definitely raise the donk to about 1000 and then shut down if he calls – this might be a bit of a spew and open us up to some bluffs on the river if we check behind the turn and say the flush doesn't hit and the BB leads out – do we call? This hand, and spots like it, cause me a headache!!! Looking at the hand he showed down I wonder if we can get him off it…

 

Hand 52 (97s): With antes and only 12BB this is a shove or fold spot. The 2.5x raise might look really strong to some players, but will get you in trouble vs weak ones. From this spot I'm shoving… 22+, any Ace, KTo+, K7s+, QTo+, Q8s+, JTo, J8s+, T8s+, 97s+, 87s, 76s so basically any broadway, any ace, any pair and then suited connectors and 2 gappers with a picture card. So this is a shove! When the SB raises you're getting 37%, which almost prices you in to a call. However, he is repping massive strength considering you're raise 2.5x on a 12BB stack with antes.

 

Hand 57 (A8o): Does SB limp a lot? I think I shove here as there are so many horrible flops when we stand to have the best hand pre considering his limp. As played I'm not sure I can comment on the flop raise.

 

Hand 58 (KJs): Again with 12BB with antes your range for shoving from the SB vs BB should be huge and KJs is right at the top of that range. I think you should be shoving any two card that aren't horrible, like 92o. So definitely shove here. 

 

Hand 67 (Q8o): With less than 10BB and an M of 4 you can't limp the SB here. You are in shove/fold mode and need to preserve your stack to maximise your fold equity. By limping here you're suddenly down to 9BB.

 

Hand 71 (66): This is a tough spot as the utg limper has a biggish stack and you probably won't be able to get him to fold. However, in this spot when you're getting pretty desperate I think you just have to shove and pray to win a flip. Not to be results oriented, but if you shove I'm sure utg calls and then you double up to 20BB where you have more room to maneuver as opposed to the 14BB you're left with and still in push/fold mode.

 

Hand 79 (44): With 8BB and an M of 3 you are really searching for any playable hand and 44 is way good enough to get it in here. You only have a few hands before the blinds hit you again when you lose all fold equity. 

 

Hand 83 (54o): I think this is a shove. You have more than enough chips to damage BB's stack and 54o isn't THAT bad when called. What sort of range would you put BB on to call you here? I think it would be pretty tight, something like 22+,ATs+,KJs+,QJs,JTs,ATo+,KQo (12.8%) which you have 30.8% equity against. This means 87.2% of the time you will win 1050 chips uncontested (915). When he does call you will win 30.8% of the time so 12.8%*30.8%*7736 (the total pot if you shove and he calls) = 399. This is a cEV of 1314. (Can someone check the Maths on this please – my head hurts).

 

Hand 86 (88): Just shove. Hands that might call your 11BB shove like 55 are definitely going to fold to your pfr. Also if you just shove your weaker hands (like the A5s) and raise your bigger hands like 88 then you will soon be exploitable. 

 

Hand 92 (QTo): This is a shove again as this time you have much more equity against his calling range and there is more to be won. 

 

Hand 95 (KTo): This is a shove as well. Broadway hands are great to get all in with a short stack, although I'd like someone to tell me why (?). None of the stacks behind you will be able to call without a strong hand and you will probably take the pot down a huge percentage of the time. 

 

Hand 100 (J6o): This might be close to a shove when the SB limps. He'll definitely need a strong hand to call after limping. I'd like others' thought on this. What's our range for shoving here? Again I don't think I can comment on the BvsB play as I'm horrendous! I don't think you should bet the turn though as your hand has showdown value, albeit very weak sdv.

 

Hand 102 (87o): I think this is quite close to being a shove. How close are we to the money bubble? Has it already passed? I think if we are close to the bubble then this is a shove. Again, thoughts from others gratefully received.

 

Hand 106 (AKo): Again just shove as you're making it obvious you have a big hand by raising.

 

Hand 108 (33): Definite shove.

 

Hand 109 (AJo): Definitely shove again rather than raising. By opening you open yourself up to flats and then will be put in gross spots post. Just shove.

 

Hand 111 (A4o): I think this is a shove, although maybe that's a bit loose. You have a lot of fold equity against the majority of the players behind you who will all need a really strong hand to call.

 

Hand 112 (A5s): This is a shove.

 

Hand 123 (22): This is a shove. Again, you're looking for any playable hand while you still have FE. 

 

Hand 126 (77): Shove! Gross way to end a tournament. GG.


 

thank you for your review. it showed me 3 things:

1- as previously noted with all reviews, gotta be consistent with bet sizing.

2- need to learn how and when to shove, panda is really good with this. watched his vids a few times.

3- gotta get the thought process down to where it is automatic. the amount of thought involved in each situation as you described just isn't happening. too involved in other screens and hopefully will come after repitition.

thanks Cool

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Killingbird
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August 2, 2010 - 5:36 pm
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sorry for missing week 2 guys.  I had a bunch of personal travel planned that kept me pretty far from poker for a bit.  Going to dig in to Week 3 here very soon.

 

Loving this idea Jdog!

lespaulgman
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Looking forward to your thoughts on Week3 Killingbird. I'd love to hear what you have to think about it.

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