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Villain just got moved to the table. He is 40-something asian with a big stack, appears competent.
Blinds 150/300, ante50
Folded to Hero In the SB with 10
9
. Raises to 850.
Villain Calls.
Flop 5
610.
Hero (20,000) bets 1000.
Villain(40,000) raises to 2500.
Hero…..
Man this is kind of tough. I don't want to 3b here and get blown of our hand if he 4b shoves us since we have a decent amount of equity against his range. Asians do tend to be on the gambley side so wouldnt put it past him to 4b shove us here with any random two spades. Since he just got moved to the table we dont know for sure. I'd probably call his raise and reeval turn.
TPE Pro
August 3, 2011
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Honestly I check here and pot control. Think this flop is going to get challenged in position a ton of the time with draws or one pair to find out where they are cuz thats the live move. Check/call flop and reevaluate. I think if a blank comes I check/raise turn and then you will probably find out where you really are in the hand. Def not an easy spot. But you can get value and control the pot by checking that flop oop. As played I am flatting his raise and reeval turn like cougars said.
i think applying pressure on this board oop to a new guy w a huge stack is bad from the gitgo on such a nasty board. my thinking if im him “is.he's trying to steal this. can he withand a raise oop” and bam put it on u, and apply an awkward spot on u. in fact thats what he did…chk call line here imo..a lot of good turn cards for us, and him possibly..lets not inflate pot..lets pot control..n see what he does…as played 4betfold..or fold
Danny I like your line alot, hadn't considered the ck/raise/fold turn option. But it does feel a little gross giving a free card on this board, and I am losing around 1/4 of my stack this way without showdown when I have to fold.
Nobody likes reraise/folding flop here? Ingame I didn't, but when stoved ranges that could 3b me on this flop, I was crushed by them. So if I raise fold to some flush draws sometimes and end the pot right there against hands I'm ahead of is this such a bad result? Too much equity torched when he's semibluff ships?
Just from playing a lot of live tournaments, I can say that almost any player with position and his chip stack is going to raise you on a flop that dry. Since he just moved to your table, it's hard to judge what you should do here. I agree with Danny that I probably would have checked the flop and evaluated from there.
I would assume here that he is raising you with any pp, any flopped pair, and any sort of straight or flush draw. Since you could be up against a hand like JQ or AJ of spades, you're going to have to fade a lot of scare cards.
Taking the line you did, I think you have to fold or call and become very passive. If you're lucky and a blank comes on the turn, he may check back there with flush/over-cards and you could narrow his range, but there are so many scare cards that come on the turn given his potential range.
Firstly, lets come up with a flop raising range. If he is indeed competent then he should not be raising any Tx hands and will be calling them instead.
This leaves a flop raising range of value, semi-bluffs and airballs which is going to be pretty wide here.
- For value our opponent has 55-66 and 56s.
- Semi-bluffs include 78s for straight draws, middle pairs, combo draws and naked flush draws (many of which will have overcards).
- We can add many airball bluffs here such as Kx suited (non spades)
As I first look at this hand, I feel peeling here is best due to our opponents wide range. With the range I have allocated, we have as much as 67% equity. However, we are going to have to play our top pair as a bluff catcher across two streets which can easily expose us to making a mistake. Further, there are going to be many turn cards which we don't like and leave us guessing. So, if we do choose to peel a street here then we need to come up with a plan for the various turn cards that we will see.
I will analyse this spot further within the next day or so. Perhaps this will buy us time as a community to come up with a plan for turns and possible rivers.
faced this situation almost exactly bout a week ago, Venetian deep stack series, 340$ buy in. Hand goes:
folds to MP 3x raise, i flat w/ A10s in SB
Flop goes like 7 4 10, i check, he cbets to over 3/4 pot
I raise it up only to get jammed on…
Putting his range on similar hands to above, mip pairs, 89 type hand(draws) or KQish, all gonna cbet 100% of the time imo, i make the call
Player tables Jacks 🙁
turn n river brick out sending me to the rail
July 3, 2010
Offline
Danny I like your line alot, hadn’t considered the ck/raise/fold turn option. But it does feel a little gross giving a free card on this board, and I am losing around 1/4 of my stack this way without showdown when I have to fold.
Nobody likes reraise/folding flop here? Ingame I didn’t, but when stoved ranges that could 3b me on this flop, I was crushed by them. So if I raise fold to some flush draws sometimes and end the pot right there against hands I’m ahead of is this such a bad result? Too much equity torched when he’s semibluff ships?
If you chk/call you might end up investing pretty close to the same as if you 4/fold so why wouldn’t you try to reach showdown?
I mean, he probably doesn’t 3 barrel bluff you too often once you chk/call 2 streets because then it becomes pretty apparent you prob have showdown value.
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