October 9, 2014
Poker Stars No Limit Hold'em Tournament – t/t Blinds – 9 players – View hand 2600302
TournamentPokerEdge.com Hand History Converter
Player1 (SB): t3320 1 BBs – VPIP: 6, PFR: 2, 3B: 0, AF: 2,0, Hands: 52
Player2 (BB): t6790 1 BBs – VPIP: 40, PFR: 26, 3B: 5, AF: 2,3, Hands: 43
Player3 (UTG): t2525 1 BBs – VPIP: 8, PFR: 5, 3B: 4, AF: 0,0, Hands: 39
Player4 (UTG+1): t3000 1 BBs – VPIP: 29, PFR: 3, 3B: 9, AF: 0,5, Hands: 31
Hero (UTG+2): t4000 1 BBs – VPIP: 25, PFR: 15, 3B: 6, AF: 2,4, Hands: 210598
Player6 (MP1): t1975 1 BBs – VPIP: 13, PFR: 13, 3B: 7, AF: 0,0, Hands: 39
Player7 (MP2): t5391 1 BBs – VPIP: 36, PFR: 23, 3B: 9, AF: 1,3, Hands: 83
Player8 (CO): t9553 1 BBs – VPIP: 13, PFR: 10, 3B: 8, AF: 0,0, Hands: 30
Player9 (BTN): t4166 1 BBs – VPIP: 26, PFR: 21, 3B: 0, AF: 0,7, Hands: 19
Pre Flop: (t0) Hero is UTG+2 with 7 7
1 fold, Player4 calls t0, Hero calls t0, 5 folds, Player2 checks
Flop: 7 K 2 (3 players)
Player2 checks, Player4 checks, Hero bets t322, Player2 calls t322, Player4 folds
Turn: (t644) A (2 players)
Player2 checks, Hero checks
River: (t644) 6 (2 players)
Player2 bets t1000, Hero folds
Here I open limp cause stacks are schallow,
1.Should I here barrel the turn also, and try to get paid by any random hand with a heart in it, and avoiding that V bluffs me on the river?(cause in my experience people bluff less the river when I barrel flop en turn)
When I 2th barrel the turn what to do when I face a xR
2. As played can I call the river?
I folded here cause it was a limped pot and villian could have any random heart combination, and the pot was not so massive
TPE Pro
December 6, 2012
Hi Wappie, thanks for posting this hand.
I don't think shallow stacks are a good reason to limp. In fact I think they are more of a reason to raise, so that's what I would have done.
I like the turn check, because of what you said – it sucks to face a check-raise, and this is a bad card for you. Yes checking will sometimes cost you the pot, but you have to weigh that against putting a lot of money in the pot and possibly getting raised off of your equity if you bet. I'd be more inclined to bet-fold a hand like AKo with no heart, because then if I'm raised I don't mind folding, as I'm probably drawing dead. But I don't want to get raised off my hand when I have redraws.
Another advantage of checking is that you may induce V to put money into the pot light on non-heart rivers. For that reason, I'd call the river bet. Yes, he could have a flush, but he could also have a King or an Ace. It's not enough just to identify hands that beat you and then fold (or hands that you can beat and then call). You have to think about all of the hands V could have, consider the pot odds you are getting, and then decide whether you will win often enough to make calling correct.
October 9, 2014
Foucault said:
Hi Wappie, thanks for posting this hand.
I don't think shallow stacks are a good reason to limp. In fact I think they are more of a reason to raise, so that's what I would have done.
I like the turn check, because of what you said – it sucks to face a check-raise, and this is a bad card for you. Yes checking will sometimes cost you the pot, but you have to weigh that against putting a lot of money in the pot and possibly getting raised off of your equity if you bet. I'd be more inclined to bet-fold a hand like AKo with no heart, because then if I'm raised I don't mind folding, as I'm probably drawing dead. But I don't want to get raised off my hand when I have redraws.
Another advantage of checking is that you may induce V to put money into the pot light on non-heart rivers. For that reason, I'd call the river bet. Yes, he could have a flush, but he could also have a King or an Ace. It's not enough just to identify hands that beat you and then fold (or hands that you can beat and then call). You have to think about all of the hands V could have, consider the pot odds you are getting, and then decide whether you will win often enough to make calling correct.
Thank you so mutch for your answers, this helps me alot.
But 1 thing in your answer I`m not shure I understand,-“I don't think shallow stacks are a good reason to limp. In fact I think they are more of a reason to raise, so that's what I would have done”
But if I would raise with my pocket pairs here, with these stacksizes, then I`m forced to fold if somebody 3 bets behind
if I use the 15-1 rule(except really weak players I use 10-1).
I give a example;
Larc21 (MP1): BB = 79.4, t4762
RiverFriend1 (MP2): BB = 25.7, t1544
BoczekBoczek (CO): BB = 40.7, t2440
spassk_dv (BTN): BB = 92.4, t5544
Ferblink.Rc (SB): BB = 28.2, t1690
keronpa (BB): BB = 46.9, t2815
VaFadrian (UTG): BB = 65.0, t3898
Hero (UTG+1): BB = 46.0, t2758
Louiseana (UTG+2): BB = 117.0, t7020
Pre Flop: (t135) Hero is UTG+1 with 6 6
1 fold, Hero raises to t146, 6 folds, keronpa raises to t360, Hero calls t214
With these stacksizes Im forced to fold(not that I did in this example). When I openlimp or behind and somebody isoraises behind me then I have propper odds to call, or do I missunderstand this?
Would like to know your thoughts,
Wappie.
TPE Pro
December 6, 2012
Couple things:
1. Raising gives you a chance to win the blinds/antes immediately and also to represent a strong hand after the flop if you are called (not that you should always do the latter). This is increasingly important as stacks get shallower, because winning the pot immediately becomes more and more important as there is less money remaining in the effective stacks.
2. Raising may cause your opponent to call or even fold ome hands that would have raised your limp. So while there are some cases where you either fold to a 3-bet or call a 3-bet and have to put more into the pot than if you'd limped, there are also cases where you see the flop more cheaply than in you limped. For instance, you raise 2BB and get called by a hand that would have raised to 4BB had you limped.
3. There are times when you can call a 3B. I don't mind the call in the example you posted. You're in position, you have to call 214 more with 2400 in the effective stacks and 500+ already in the pot (don't forget to count that).
4. You probably aren't going to get 3B that often, so it shouldn't be the major factor determining how you play your hand.
October 9, 2014
Foucault said:
Couple things:
1. Raising gives you a chance to win the blinds/antes immediately and also to represent a strong hand after the flop if you are called (not that you should always do the latter). This is increasingly important as stacks get shallower, because winning the pot immediately becomes more and more important as there is less money remaining in the effective stacks.
2. Raising may cause your opponent to call or even fold ome hands that would have raised your limp. So while there are some cases where you either fold to a 3-bet or call a 3-bet and have to put more into the pot than if you'd limped, there are also cases where you see the flop more cheaply than in you limped. For instance, you raise 2BB and get called by a hand that would have raised to 4BB had you limped.
3. There are times when you can call a 3B. I don't mind the call in the example you posted. You're in position, you have to call 214 more with 2400 in the effective stacks and 500+ already in the pot (don't forget to count that).
4. You probably aren't going to get 3B that often, so it shouldn't be the major factor determining how you play your hand.
Thanks alot for the explanation, very kind.
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