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QQ multiway 3bet pot facing a flop shove.
sinigammi
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April 27, 2011 - 1:41 pm
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Hi everyone 

 

This hand is for a rush tournament so I don't have any reads. It was around 180 around people and the bubble breaks at 90 as far as I can rember

Thanks in advanced

 

Full Tilt Poker $7,500 Rush Guarantee No Limit Hold'em Tournament – t120/t240 Blinds + t25 – 9 players – View hand 1291381
TournamentPokerEdge.com Hand History Converter

BTN: BB = 36.4, t8742, M = 14.94
SB: BB = 54.1, t12989, M = 22.20
BB: BB = 219.1, t52579, M = 89.88
UTG: BB = 7.9, t1900, M = 3.25
UTG+1: BB = 132.9, t31896, M = 54.52
Hero (UTG+2): BB = 69.6, t16714, M = 28.57
MP1: BB = 55.4, t13292, M = 22.72
MP2: BB = 48.8, t11701, M = 20.00
CO: BB = 46.7, t11197, M = 19.14

Pre Flop: (t585) Hero is UTG+2 with Q of diamonds Q of hearts
UTG raises to t480, 1 fold, Hero raises to t1250, 1 fold, MP2 calls t1250, CO calls t1250, 3 folds, UTG calls t770

Flop: (t5585) 8 of diamonds 8 of clubs 3 of hearts (4 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets t2500, MP2 folds, CO raises to t9922 all in, UTG folds, Hero requests TIME ???

 

 

hapetimes
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April 27, 2011 - 9:32 pm
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def like raise sizing pre and flop sizing

i think theres like almost 2.5:1 pot odds after he jams leaving you with 5.5k so without reads etc i'd probably get it in

i dont see how he ever has us beat pre w KK or AA after the action ahead of him.. he's def 4betting these

also very unlikely that he outflopped us, and of the small amount of times he does flop gin with A8 or 33, why's he trying to push us off our hand knowing he would have our range absolutely crushed…

smells like any pair from 44-99 excluding 88 of course and possibly TT

call and fade here imo

southpaw_r32
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April 27, 2011 - 10:43 pm
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Gee, I'm not sure about calling here….. I really feel like villain has us crushed. Sure, he could be spazzing out with TT, 99, maybe even JJ or the other 2 queens. I haven't played the rush Tourney's so, can't comment on that side of the hand. Also there are zero draws on the board.

 

He called from the CO after MP2 called a 3bet………. A thinking player has gotta suspect that the UTG short stacker is jamming over the 3bet but he doesn't  confused so level of play from these players is pretty low.

 

Villain's range here that we beat:

 

44, 55, 66, 77, 99, TT, JJ (not sure if he has JJ here with the UTG short stacker, I can see him 4bet isolating here with that, but who knows, the lower pocket pairs like 44, 55 etc seem less unlikely, too aggro with too small of a hand) so we can probably narrow it down to just TT, 99 and maybe 77, the other 2 queens seem unlikely, but not impossible.

 

Villain's range that we are crushed by:

 

A8s, K8s, 87s, 98s, 88, 33 (I'll leave AA, KK out of his range, seems very unlikely in a multiway pot when he had the opportunity to 4bet preflop.

 

Pokerstove stats suggest we have the equity to call, but yuk I don't like it.

 

**** Pokerstove stats with 44, 55, 66 taken out ****

 

Board: 8d 8h 3c
Dead: 

    equity     win     tie           pots won     pots tied   
Hand 0:     50.486%      50.49%     00.00%             143946             0.00   { QQ }
Hand 1:     49.514%      49.51%     00.00%             141174             0.00   { JJ-77, 33, A8s, K8s, 98s, 87s, 98o, 87o }

**** Pokerstove stats with 44, 55, 66 included ****

 

Board: 8d 8h 3c
Dead: 

    equity     win     tie           pots won     pots tied   
Hand 0:     61.814%      61.81%     00.00%             242334             0.00   { QQ }
Hand 1:     38.186%      38.19%     00.00%             149706             0.00   { JJ-33, A8s, K8s, 98s, 87s, 98o, 87o }

sinigammi
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April 28, 2011 - 3:24 pm
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Thanks guys for the answers.

 

The truth is that the only think I was thinking that moment was TT-JJ or AA-KK.Also I agree that TT,JJ he more easily would 4bet them than AA,KK. I don´t think A8s, K8s, 87s, 98s, 44, 55, 66, 77,33 is in his range because he will expect the short stack to shove and he expect me to shove after. So why he flat call the 3bet expecting a reshove??? And if he has TT, JJ on the flop the only hand that folds is AQ, AK and maybe with this hand I wouldn´t cbet because I know that a overpair doesn´t fold even TT,JJ. So he knows that but still he shoves.All this of course if the guy thinking a bit and is not a fish.

Also what is my 3bet iso range? And what I am folding with the 4bet and what calling? And why to 4bet AA, KK if I am folding the most of my 3bet iso range ?

 

I am comfused. smile

Third@eye
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April 28, 2011 - 6:30 pm
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 I'm calling here, he could hold AA, or KK but i'd say its pretty doubtfull. If he's not bluffing youve proably got him anyway as you'd be looking at 99,1010,JJ. I cant see him anyone wasting value with A8 or 88.

But with him just calling pre i'd proably put him on A10 to AQ or KJ, KQ and going for a complete bluff on a very safe looking board.

 If utg pushed does the software allow for you to rr even tho utg has gone allin? as that could change his motive with high pairs.

 Without info on players I normally fold JJ and lower to a 4 bet but only if it means i'd be risking my tourney. Dont know if this is correct or not but thats how i'd do it.

 

 

 

hawkeyeK9
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May 8, 2011 - 3:56 pm
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Never folding here!

slickmuck
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May 8, 2011 - 7:32 pm
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Snap call and just live with it when he has AA/KK like 25% of the time

swet1
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May 9, 2011 - 10:37 am
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In a rush tourney with no stats or reads against a random I'm prob calling off here.

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