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June 8, 2012
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this is the $60 weekly $15K gtd on Merge. those that play on Merge know its a pretty nice mtt, lots of soft sports gamblers and fish, etc. We are down to 4 at the FT, two players are profitable, one is I guess reg of some sort. the villain, however, is a rec player whos -60% ROI over 180mtts or so. he got the FT as chip leader and I have zero history with him prior to FT. when we began, I guess Ive been opening a decent amount of pots but nothing substantial. he doesnt know im running 34/28 for the entire event. So I give you the first hand him and I finally played, which should have some kind of an impact on the eventual 2nd hand in question:
No Limit Hold'em Tournament T4,000/T8,000
Buy-in: $15K Gtd – [Deep]
Merge Network
7 players
Formatted by pokercopilot.com – Mac OS X hand history analysis and tracking
Stacks:
UTG – UTG (T383,221)
UTG+1 – UTG+1 (T293,827)
MP – MP (T66,470)
CO – CO (T223,200)
BTN – BTN (T78,668)
SB – Hero (T366,960)
BB – BB (T527,654)
Preflop: (T17,600, 7 players) Hero is SB with 7♣6♥
5 folds, Hero raises to T20,000, BB calls T12,000
Flop: 6♣4♠3♥ (T45,600, 2 players – Hero: T346,160, BB: T506,854)
Hero bets T21,000, BB calls T21,000
Turn: Q♥ (T87,600, 2 players – Hero: T325,160, BB: T485,854)
Hero checks, BB bets T35,000, Hero calls T35,000
River: 6♦ (T157,600, 2 players – Hero: T290,160, BB: T450,854)
Hero bets T67,980, BB raises to T140,000, Hero calls T72,020
Total Pot: T437,600
BB shows J♣2♣ (Jc 2c)
Hero shows 7♣6♥ (7c 6h)
Hero wins T437,600
so after thinking hes been trying to move up the pay scale, since he hasnt gotten involved until now…..we see that he can be bluffy. so heres the hand, i dont know what to do on the flop…i thought about stuffing but i dunno if i wanna get it in so deep against him.
No Limit Hold'em Tournament T6,000/T12,000
Buy-in: $15K Gtd – [Deep]
Merge Network
5 players
Formatted by pokercopilot.com – Mac OS X hand history analysis and tracking
Stacks:
UTG – Hero (T547,657)
CO – CO (T589,068)
BTN – BTN (T113,534)
SB – SB (T419,451)
BB – BB (T270,290)
Preflop: (T24,000, 5 players) Hero is UTG with K♠J♥
Hero raises to T24,000, CO calls T24,000, 3 folds
Flop: J♦5♦4♥ (T72,000, 2 players – Hero: T522,457, CO: T563,868)
Hero bets T36,000, CO raises to T80,000, Hero ????
I will give you street by street since I think I played it bad at first but the more I think about it…the less I hate it but im not sure lol.
oh, payouts are something like:
1st – $4.5k,
2nd – $3k
3rd – $1.9k
4th – $1.4k
comments appreciated and welcomed.
June 8, 2012
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The strategy forum is really depressing,,,
July 31, 2013
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I think he would raise AJ or a better pair pre, so I would guess his range is weighted towards flushdraws and worse top pairs like QJ/JT, maybe some small pps or 67, I think gutshots would float you again as he did before with the J2
As you said he did not get involved and seemed to want to move up/play it “safe”, that leans more towards the QJ/JT and suited aces I think
imo reraise get it in or
call and play for stacks on safe turns
comments appreciated
July 3, 2010
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Having the Kd would be nicer but the board really isn't all that draw heavy so it seems like it could be a spot for either a delayed cbet if he checks, or we can c/c down and leave him room to hang himself.
July 31, 2013
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delayed cbet? O_o
please explain 😀
June 8, 2012
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so I just call flop, at the time i didnt wanna get in for some reason…
No Limit Hold'em Tournament T6,000/T12,000
Buy-in: $15K Gtd – [Deep]
Merge Network
5 players
Formatted by pokercopilot.com – Mac OS X hand history analysis and tracking
Stacks:
UTG – Hero (T547,657)
CO – CO (T589,068)
BTN – BTN (T113,534)
SB – SB (T419,451)
BB – BB (T270,290)
Preflop: (T24,000, 5 players) Hero is UTG with K♠J♥
Hero raises to T24,000, CO calls T24,000, 3 folds
Flop: J♦5♦4♥ (T72,000, 2 players – Hero: T522,457, CO: T563,868)
Hero bets T36,000, CO raises to T80,000, Hero calls T44,000
Turn: 5♠ (T232,000, 2 players – Hero: T442,457, CO: T483,868)
Hero checks, CO bets T135,000, Hero calls T135,000
I guess I should of check piled turn but…… reason why i posted hand. if i played this well i wouldnt have posted it. thoughts here?
August 31, 2013
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Hi,
I think I would probably 3bet/call flop. His sizing is pretty small, could be any J, any draw, even 5x betting for information. I guess he would raise more with AJ or 54 on this kind of flop plus you already saw him bluff. I don't mind X/Calling down to let him bluff his stack but I would prefer a safer flop or at least AJ plus I think you are missing value if he has QJ or JT.
As played I don't know, I think when you call turn you are planing to call the shove on a lot of river, if you are behind you are probably get stacked anyway so it's probably better to keep his bluffs and just call (hand like 78 or A3). Obv you are again missing value when he has QJ or JT but maybe he will value cut himself by shoving that on safe river. So yes probably better to X/C turn but I don't mind X/shoving too.
June 8, 2012
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I think I level myself at times, which i prob did here. he cant expect me to b/c flop, c/c turn, and then think he can blow me off anything otr. I would shove big draws on flop and maybe fold weak ones on turn, so he cant expect me to have draws when i c/c turn….my hand is face up to showdown type chit. 66-TT, Jx, A4. so when we get to river, throw out a block maybe? or let him pile it in…? it shud be obvious im not folding so if he bets he cant be bluffing can he? nor can he value worse?
No Limit Hold'em Tournament T6,000/T12,000
Buy-in: $15K Gtd – [Deep]
Merge Network
5 players
Formatted by pokercopilot.com – Mac OS X hand history analysis and tracking
Stacks:
UTG – Hero (T547,657)
CO – CO (T589,068)
BTN – BTN (T113,534)
SB – SB (T419,451)
BB – BB (T270,290)
Preflop: (T24,000, 5 players) Hero is UTG with K♠J♥
Hero raises to T24,000, CO calls T24,000, 3 folds
Flop: J♦5♦4♥ (T72,000, 2 players – Hero: T522,457, CO: T563,868)
Hero bets T36,000, CO raises to T80,000, Hero calls T44,000
Turn: 5♠ (T232,000, 2 players – Hero: T442,457, CO: T483,868)
Hero checks, CO bets T135,000, Hero calls T135,000
River: Q♥ (T502,000, 2 players – Hero: T307,457, CO: T348,868)
Hero ?????
January 15, 2013
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My problem is that you played the two streets so that you have no idea where you are in the hand. On flop, three bet. As played lead out 1/3 pot on turn. If he raises you AGAIN, then you can be fairly confident, since he is not a savvy villian, that he has the goods.
Let me quess, he was on a queen high flush draw and thus got there on the river? If so, probably not much you could do since people at -60% generally are not going to be extricated from their flush draws, paired boards or not. BUT, if has zip and pip like he did the first time around, or a marginal hand, I don't see him raising you two streets.
July 3, 2010
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cardopushr said:
delayed cbet? O_o
please explain 😀
Just a fancy term for saying check the flop and bet the turn instead 🙂
You can do that for a couple reasons:
1. to not get check-raised or raised and have to play a bigger pot than you want
2. to disguise your hand strength which will either let your opponent catch up in the hand and call you later, or could make your opponent decide to try to run a bluff and take the lead in the hand
A good time to do it is when you don't think your opponent will call on flop, turn, and also river and when there are also not too many cards that can arrive on the turn that will scare you.
July 31, 2013
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thx I know the concept, I thought you meant it was applied here which I did not see 🙂
TPE Pro
September 28, 2012
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I like the flop flat, I think there can be an interesting case made for donking the turn smallish to induce a spaz, especailly if you dont know if he is willing to continue a bluff on multiple streets, or if he is going to check back his weak draws(essentailly buying the river on the flop with a raise). This way if he does have a hand liek 67 or even a weaker J or something he plans on controlling on turn, he cant. My plan agaisnt this villain would be to bet, and depnding on river eitehr checking to induce or bombing(cause I assume he never flats a better hand on turn).
Checking is also fine, and the decision between c/r and c/c is interesting, and something that I would have to make in game based off intuition/table flow/reads. Obviously we are not all the vulnerable, we are slightly worried about A and Q, but more so from a losing out on value perspective and not necessarily becuase we are going to be beat. c/r is nice cuase we can get in all his Jx's and if hes bad he may get in some flush draws which dont have equity against us with 1 card to come.
I think I default to letting the fish bluff on this board(aka c/c). The turn pairing the 5 is slightly interesting(not that we expect him to have a 5 very often), in that people may not continue their bluffs, but really bad players will. It is a turn I expect to get checked back a lot with weaker hands, for pot control reasons(like I said earlier), so this does favor the donk lead a little more(and also a turn that I expect him to spaz over a donk lead more to rep a 5 he thinks you never have).
The river is a pretty much no brainer c/c imo. Donking has value agasint all his jx, but thats about it. We let him continue his bluffs, and he might be delusional enough to think he has added bluff value and the Q is a scare card for your j/x hands(to be fair weaker Jx that are playing to chop would be a meh call and sometimes in game I may meh fold for ICm reasons if my edge is huge).
There isnt a single hand(except maaaaaybe Aj) that beats us that is checking river, which sucks cause we are not that nutted, but I do thnk given the first hand he can have a lot of bluffs.
i could see a case being made for blocker bet on river, but I still dont liek it agasint this guy(based off the first hand posted).
My guess is he showed up with KK or AA.
For Coaching - ccuster911@gmail.com - HH Reviews/Leak Finder(HEM or PT)/Concept Discussion
June 8, 2012
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Thanks for the replies. I chk river and he insta bombed it for 2/3 pot. so I actually folded river lol. Pretty bad I know. I just didn’t think he was bluffing often or vb worse but again I wouldn’t of posted if I played it well or if my thought process was sound.
July 3, 2010
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cardopushr said:
thx I know the concept, I thought you meant it was applied here which I did not see 🙂
In my first post I said it could be a spot for one. That doesn't mean it was actually done.
At any rate, a waste of a 2nd post due to a very unclear question :/
June 8, 2012
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Ive been really awful short handed at FTs lately, costing me like $10k the past two months and its tilting the chit out of me. I could blame variance and avoid my part in it but im being honest with myself and quite hard on myself too….happenned last night too 3 handed in the 10k gtd.
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