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Full Tilt Poker $8,500 Guarantee No Limit Hold'em Tournament – t250/t500 Blinds + t50 – 8 players
TournamentPokerEdge.com Hand History Converter
ZSIGULINO (CO): BB = 12.5, t6242
nusum (BTN): BB = 17.5, t8727
Jelle Schenk (SB): BB = 25.2, t12624
7jacksparrow1 (BB): BB = 54.8, t27393
estremos (UTG): BB = 37.7, t18836
FunkyRide (UTG+1): BB = 73.7, t36842
llebdet (MP1): BB = 46.4, t23214
elektro86 (MP2): BB = 35.5, t17760
Pre Flop: (t1150) FunkyRide is UTG+1 with T
T
1 fold, FunkyRide raises to t1050, llebdet raises to t2840, 5 folds, FunkyRide calls t1790
Flop: (t6830) T
8
7 (2 players)
FunkyRide checks, llebdet bets t3245, FunkyRide calls t3245
Turn: (t13320) J (2 players)
FunkyRide checks, llebdet checks
River: (t13320) 2 (2 players)
FunkyRide bets t7000, llebdet calls t7000
Final Pot: t27320
FunkyRide shows T T (three of a kind, Tens)
llebdet mucks J K
FunkyRide wins t27320
do you lead the turn so you can shove river?
June 11, 2010
Offline
I lead the turn. You called his 3bet and his flop bet. He knows you have to have something and the board texture shouldn't really line up with your hand all that well (i.e. straights or flushes shouldn't be in there on the flop, but the Turn brings some interesting draws for your hand). I would aim for a halfish pot bet on the turn and be happy to get it in with him on the river. If he jams on my on the turn I think I am pretty comfortable getting it in as I'm really only afraid of JJ from a average opponents 3b range and compared to all the hands he could have that is a pretty small %, but draws become a much more substantial part.
Thanks for the interesting post. As played I would also tend to lead turn for a bit more than half pot. I probably would have bet half pot on the flop with such a coordinated board. As played, say you lead the turn and he 3 bets you. Seems like a tough spot. I agree that you are not really going to see a 9 there too often, but given his pre flop aggression, I think you get more value by betting the flop. I will be interested to hear any more comments on this idea.
tbh i'd probably check raise the flop to 8k-ish
i mean he's showing strength pre by 3betting our UTG+1 raise so i'd basically build a pot for value from all of his overpairs which he's probably never folding and 4 bet shoving/stacking off with
as played you gotta lead the turn b/c he shouldnt have a 9 and rarely has JJ
a little over half pot and again on the river
July 3, 2010
Offline
I'm looking to c/r this flop, too. An overpair to the board could spaz on you and at the very least we're value raising top set and continuing to build the pot.
Agree with previous posters…I c/r the flop due to the texture with hoping overs spaz and get it in. There are a lot of cards on the turn that you won't like to see moving forward. I would lead though with the way played to control the pot and if raised can make decisions at that point. I think by leading turn to shove river, you are only getting called with better hands imo. The way played you controled the pot size, but weren't in control of the hand.
**On a side note, what do you guys think of a 4 bet pre? I kind of like it with your stack sizes and do you really want to play 10s oop? Thoughts would be great.
I not really a fan of 4-betting here as you're essentially turning 10's into a bluff. If he shoves you have to fold, and if he flats behind you, you're playing a bloated pot out of position with just 10's. And not every board is going to be as kind, and not every opponent will turn up with KJo. Depending on the reads on the player, I think just flatting the 3-bet is the best option.
ill never 4bet here either
hes folding <99 and 4bet jamming the rest, to which we would have to fold throwing away all our equity
July 3, 2010
Offline
Too deep to 4 bet, in my opinion. There's barely an ante yet so I feel like we need to be a lot more shallow to just rip it in with TT.
Curious to hear what you all think is the optimal stack size for jamming.
Since we have no stats from OP on the 3 bettor we're talking “in a vacuum”
I think like 20 bb and under we rip it in. 20-30 bb we can flat and then evaluate the possibility of jamming a low flop, etc.
I dunno. I still need to work on this part of my game.
I personally like leading this flop since he 3bet you pre. If you lead the flop he might try and continue to represent a big hand and 3bet again. If it works you can flat and either lead turn or check because he is prob going to continue. Check/raise on the flop is fine but I like the lead out more.
I like the 3bet flat pre not 4betting for reasons stated already. Besides worrying about draws One thing that would make me lead or or not on the turn is if I think thare are many cards that will kill the action. in this particular case I like the lead to charge draws and to give us the chance to get 2 streets of value. if he has something he will call you on the turn anyway so even if he folds to the river bet you are not losing value to weaker hands. Say it was a T37 rainbow flop and then the J on the turn I might be more inclined to check it so he can catch up
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