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April 26, 2013
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So here is the 3rd hand, ITM in the Big $27.50 on stars. A typical AK situation. been playing poker for aover 1,5 years now and still having trouble here, can't believe it.
blinds: 900/1800/225, 8 handed
pre: UTG (stack: 88k) opens to 3960, we (stack: 63k) sit in the hijack and look down at A
K. The UTG is opening 20/15 over 45 hands, his UTG opening is 8%, so nothing too much out of line here. We reraise to 8100. This is fairly small, but we have position, so I think a tiny 2x should be fine – still should I better make it something like 8999 here, or just flat??
Villain flats our 3bet.
flop: T
6
T
Very dry. Still some T are in his flatting range I think. ATs, JTs beeing the most likely. He could have a boat with 66, or a monster like AA/KK, but all very unlikely, we got blockers. I think it's more likely for him to have AQ, KQs, 55 – 99.
He checks, I cbet 7245 into a pot of 20700. Should we just check a paired board with AKs? I perhaps would do so if we had the backdoor flush draw, but with only 2 overs I think we reveal our hand a bit less if we bet kinda smallish. Any ideas?
Villain calls.
turn: 4
Ok, this should change nothing at all. Time to 2-barral-bluff him off his small pairs and take that pot. He checks, I bet 19354 into 35190, leaving behind 28800 in my stack. He 3bets to 48600, putting me all-in.
We ???
Yeah, maybe I noob-misplayed AKs here. What do you think? Just check back the flop? Or at least avoid that donkish turn bet? I mean, what does he have here? Hate this spot, please TPE-pros, help!
September 5, 2013
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I rather flat vs a utg open but if you're intention is to 3b to get it in there is nothing wrong with it. Your sizing is fine. Flop cbet is fine, your turn sizing is way to big. If you make it something like 12k you will leave 30k behind with a 60k pot. SPR would be better to triplle barrel.
June 3, 2012
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I think preflop and flop are fine, but like you said… turn changes nothing, so odds are if he liked his hand on the flop, he probably still likes it on the turn unless he has a complete float. Betting here (especially this big) is going to get you owned by his value range, and nothing from his air range, as well as you giving up your equity in the pot (unless he has a ten, you often have 6 outs here). I'd prefer a turn check and evaluate the river. Most will try to get to showdown on the river with their weak value hands and bet their monsters/air and you can make a decision based on reads and bet sizing.
June 1, 2012
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Flat your whole range vs a UTG opens thats what i do because it works. As played, Cbet size on the flop is fine probaly go a little bigger like 10k. Turn i would be checking back my entire range on this turn to stop myself from getting indiscriminatly shoved on and to stop myself from getting bluffed on the river. To a riverbet i would fold most of the time without any great reads. Also, use Pokertracker4 or some Hand history converter to post on the forums because it makes the hands easier for people to analyse.
January 20, 2014
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I like your 3 bet PF, and I like your cbet on the flop. Sizing looks good to me. I would probably check the turn though. Maybe I'm just a wimp, but look at it from his position:
He's raised PF in EP.
Then he called our 3bet, closing the action, knowing he's OOP for the rest of the hand.
He check/calls our cbet on the flop.
Now he checks to us again on the turn.
I think we should take a free card here. It sure feels like we're beat. I think he's doing this w/ 66+ or a 10 in his hand. I don't think he's doing this w/ like AQ or KQ.
I think we should take a free card and see what happens on the river.
April 26, 2013
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Thanks for the feedback guys. Definitly agree that turn bet was totally unnecessary. Maybe I'll just flat next time pre.
Well, as I said, after the turn bet, he put us all in. Since I was sure I was beat I folded, leaving only a few chips in my stack. He then happily showed me his 98 for a gutshot draw. That was so sick. 😀 He had a 22.7% chance to win on turn, if I called.
June 3, 2012
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Pretty sick bluff on his part, considering you're getting such a good price that you shouldn't be folding very often to this shove. At the same time, it's VERY hard for you to have tens in your range (think about what hands with a ten you are 3betting an UTG opener with besides TT). You also probably don't show up with 66 here, so you're pretty capped at AA, while villain can have some tens (not very many, but a few) and 66 having peeled a small 3bet.
June 1, 2012
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You allowed yourself to get bluffed by butchering the whole hand you should just be flatting your entire range pre against UTG opens.
June 3, 2012
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I'd be interested in hearing why we shouldn't have a 3betting range against UTG openers. Is it something specific to this stack depth?
January 30, 2013
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3 bet vs UTG open is totes fine, sizing pretty good can go slightly bigger since we are deepish but whatever.
We can check back flop or Cbet either is gucci, we likley have the best hand a good amount of the time. Also can get worse ax to call like aj, aq, etc.
Turn I see no reason why we turn our hand into a bluff or bet so huge? We have a good amount of show down value and actually are near the top of our range in this spot. Better isn't folding on this card often enough and turning a hand this good into a bluff seems bad.
Also not sure why we bet this big on turn since if we have the pair value part of our range which is JJ+ I assume, why would we bet so big on turn? We want his small pairs calling so betting that big doesn't make a ton of sense.
Would rather take this line with a hand that has little to no showdown value, but bet smaller on turn to shove a lot of rivers.
June 1, 2012
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Its not terrible to have a 3bet range vs openers but its not a great play ethier without a very good reason. Reason being it just looks redicolously strong and will cause good opponents to lay down good hands when you want action the most that is why 3betting AAs vs UTG opens is terrible. It also lowers the SPR preflop making your potisional advantage in the hand worth a lot less because good players like to play pots in potision as deep as possible. Also, your opponents even very loose ones like myself will have a much tighter range for raising UTG for this very reason and you should want to keep their ranges as wide as possible while in potision.
I think i would of just flatted this hand preflop and raised the flop on this texture for these reasons. Since i dont have a 3bet range against UTG opens i will have a wider value range and can prevent myself from being rebluffed in this spot in the rare cases my opponent decides to try this play because i will have to many value hands to defend against it. Ofcourse everything is situational, and sometimes you can even hero call it off with AK here.
January 20, 2014
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Interesting … I've never heard that line before about not 3betting UTG openers.
TPE Pro
August 25, 2012
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3bet pre is pretty much mandatory, cbet and sizing are good. Checking back those flops in 3bet pots just says “hey, I have AK, bluff me off this hand please”.
However, I really dislike your turn betsizing. I think betting is kind of okay if we really feel he's capable of folding a middle pair (which a lot of players just aren't in this spot), but 19k into 35k is way too big. We can bet 13k or so and achieve the same thing, and it avoids any complications when we do get check/shoved on because we're no longer getting quite such good odds.
Having said that, we still probably have about 5-10% equity vs his check/shove range here on turn, so it's an easy bet/fold. I think checking turn to give up is fine though since he will occasionally show down AQ and he won't fold mid pairs that often.
March 11, 2014
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redvulture61 said:
I think i would of just flatted this hand preflop and raised the flop on this texture for these reasons. Since i dont have a 3bet range against UTG opens i will have a wider value range and can prevent myself from being rebluffed in this spot in the rare cases my opponent decides to try this play because i will have to many value hands to defend against it. Ofcourse everything is situational, and sometimes you can even hero call it off with AK here.
Why would you raise the flop here with AK if you flat pre? You a) Have the best hand a lot of the time and hardly letting any better hands fold by raising , b) if a K or A falls on the turn villian is going to try and rep it and you can call it off and c) villian is giving op on some other turns as well and you can check it down for showdown value or decide if you want to turn your hand into a bluff later.
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