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November 8, 2010
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Another hand from me. Again, interested in how I could've played this hand better to extract max value. I am happy with my play until the river, what should I have bet here?
Poker Stars $1.00 No Limit Hold'em Tournament – t75/t150 Blinds – 9 players
TournamentPokerEdge.com Hand History Converter
Hero (SB): t2250 15 BBs
carlosdiez (BB): t3400 22.67 BBs
nazifa1961 (UTG): t2800 18.67 BBs
vivi73384 (UTG+1): t8080 53.87 BBs
Rinat1975 (UTG+2): t5770 38.47 BBs
xbelieverx (MP1): t7720 51.47 BBs
Alea II (MP2): t7455 49.70 BBs
rimov (CO): t2335 15.57 BBs
Gadya Petrov (BTN): t10320 68.80 BBs
Pre Flop: (t225) Hero is SB with 6
6
1 fold, vivi73384 calls t150, 1 fold, xbelieverx calls t150, Alea II calls t150, rimov calls t150, 1 fold, Hero calls t75, carlosdiez checks
Flop: (t900) A 6
2 (6 players)
Hero checks, carlosdiez checks, vivi73384 checks, xbelieverx checks, Alea II checks, rimov checks
Turn: (t900) 4
(6 players)
Hero bets t600, carlosdiez folds, vivi73384 folds, xbelieverx folds, Alea II folds, rimov calls t600
River: (t2100) J (2 players)
Hero bets t1500 all in, rimov folds
June 11, 2010
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Biggest difference I have with your line is that I am never checking the flop here. Bet this bad boy. You have a strong hand, put out a bet, if someone has an Ace then they will most likely call you and if they don't have a hand that they will call with then they fold and you have essentially received “max value” for the hand. I think it is a dangerous idea to try to get crafty and try to stack an opponent with tricky play. The guys at this level aren't going to notice what you are trying to do and more often than not you are going to let guys draw out to weird hands on you cheaply and then wonder why you lost. Bet your strong hands, play then fast and hard. As for the rest of your line you bet sufficiently to be able to get your whole stack in on the river as a reasonable bet so I think you did just fine.
Quite simply, if you had missed this flop would you have bet?
If not, why not? Is it because you are likely to get called?
If that is true, then why don't you bet when you hit it?
Do you think they can read your soul and somehow know when you do and don't have a set?
We all know we should hide the value of our hand somehow. We can do it in two ways, either we can bet sometimes when we miss, or check sometimes when we hit.
checking sometimes loses a hand we should have won.
betting sometimes wins a hand we should have lost.
How bad is it just to play your sets here face up? Well, that depends on your opposition.
As a general rule, I will assume that in a multiway pot there is at least one bad player in there. If there isn't then fair enough, they fold and I still win which kinda beats checking and losing anyway.
You will often read “they are likely to be terrible players” as an excuse to do all sorts of bad moves. A lot of these comments involve making gambles for your stack and I can see why some players might not feel confident enough to take advantage of bad players especially at a $1 game, but here we are specifically talking about how to extract value from a hand we do not want to fold. When it comes to extrcting value just betting works best against most players, even more so against bad ones. The less likely you are to fold, the more likely it should be that you bet. Let weaker hands do the checking and calling 😉
now if you want to try out dfferent moves, then why not try a weak lead?
A weak lead generally means a small bet, say a third of the pot. The hope here would be that someone with an Ace decides to defend against you drawing.
Weak lead or standard bet, either way is fine, the weak lead is slightly more dangerous but it can play great from time to time.
Don't be doing that checking thing any more though, its aint good.
November 8, 2010
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Thanks for both replies. I guess my thinking was that in checking the flop , someone with an Ace would bet and I'd get the value that way.
But I agree, I should be betting the set on the flop, I like the idea of a weak bet (third pot) which would have an Ace raising.
July 3, 2010
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I lead into a big multiway pot here. No one is putting you on a set. I'd bet like 250-300 to rep a medium strength hand like a flush draw or 2nd pair. If a limper has a decent Ax hand you're getting raised and then it all gets into the middle with these stack sizes.
If you check and the whole field checks behind and a club comes it makes life tougher.
Or if you check and there is a smallish bet and multiple calls you're now allowing all drawing hands proper odds to suck out on you.
TPE Pro
TPE Management
July 20, 2010
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i like lead and hope someones on a draw or has the ace. looks like a big pot in your future
October 6, 2010
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philomilo said:
Thanks for both replies. I guess my thinking was that in checking the flop , someone with an Ace would bet and I'd get the value that way.
But I agree, I should be betting the set on the flop, I like the idea of a weak bet (third pot) which would have an Ace raising.
if you check, only the strong ace type hands will bet, some will check behind, but if you bet, a LOT of ace hands will call, probably all of them.
if this was heads up then checking planning on the check raise is ok, but when there are this many i prefer just leading out and hoping one of them calls
NEVER slow play sets on boards with draws or aces on them.
Frankly it does not matter what you do. You have 15 big blinds and you are in a zone where it does not matter whether you lead or c/r all in. You will be paid off.
This is 100% push preflop by the way. Seeing a flop here is waste of money.
SittingDucks said:
Frankly it does not matter what you do. You have 15 big blinds and you are in a zone where it does not matter whether you lead or c/r all in. You will be paid off.
This is 100% push preflop by the way. Seeing a flop here is waste of money.
Great point Ducks, I was wondering the same thing, why not push with 15 bb's with all the extra chips in the middle, it has to be positive EV. Of course at this level you may get 4 callers, lol.
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