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Home Forum MTT Poker Strategy Final Table Edge: How to get it

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Final Table Edge: How to get it

LordScanner

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December 13, 2012 - 11:49 am

I couldn't be happier with TPE for the obvious improvements in my game. I'm basically a live player and made it down to quite a few FTs this year.

In the past 3 deeps runs I was out once in the FT bubble (shove 44 on the BTN and got called by 55 on the BB), once in 7th (JJ vs KK in a shallow structure), and most recently in 5th in a big 6-Max Tourney in which I had TT in the SB against a BTN open (AKo) in an open/3bet/shove/call. I've spent the past 3 days thinking a lot about it. In all of the cases things were getting very shallow (average under 15BBs) and I ended up moving to try to get a confortable stack before things became a shoving lottery.

Some friends say that all cases were standard and some obvious coolers, but I'm not fully satisfied. How to find the right aggression level on a FT, and how to keep accumulating chips to aim to the top positions and avoid flipping too much? Is it just a case of taking more marginal spots without risking tournament life?

People always rec SNGs but I feel the dynamic is very different from MTT FT, given the different stack sizes, pay jumps.

Thanks.

kingten102

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December 13, 2012 - 12:21 pm

Short answer is find tournaments with better structures in the late stages.

Long answer is find more spots to pick up chips before you get to that final table.

Ie: abuse the bubble. Learn which stack sizes you effectively steal with and or 3 bet jam
With to pick up those extra chips to account for such shallow stacks deep in the tournament

LordScanner

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December 13, 2012 - 12:40 pm

Kingten102,

Thanks for the answer. In 2 of the cases mentioned I had a decent stack size (a bit over the average) but had the CLs to my left.

In the 6-Max Tourney the structure was quite good. When FT started average was 45BBs, but after 5 40-minute levels we were still 5 handed and things were much shallower. I guess the pay structure had much to do with it ($35.500 / 24.500 / 14.500 / 9.000 / 6.000 / 4.000).

I was willing to up the agg as I wanted to ship it but was card dead. I've managed to make moves to keep an average stack but not much besides that. I guess working on the stack size before the FT is the solution.

Turbulence

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December 14, 2012 - 9:09 pm

LordScanner said:

.

People always rec SNGs but I feel the dynamic is very different from MTT FT, given the different stack sizes, pay jumps.

.

Playing 9 or 6max STSNGs i think is a good way for preparing for FT dynamics, bubble play ect obviously you all start with the same stack but that very quickly changes. It also teaches how to be patient with the short stack, and push fold ect.

aka Prophead340 aka Prophead2000 aka Turbulence_1

PocketFives Profile: .....urbulence/

trainwreq

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December 18, 2012 - 10:23 pm

I definitely agree with playing a lot of 9 man SNGs. I also started playing as many 18, 27, and 45 man SNGs as I could when I had similar problems. Same idea with MTSNGs, except you get yourself in “final table” situations more frequently. It's all about practice really. Also, try not to be so results-oriented. In the situations you listed above, it sounds like you made the correct play, and just got coolered. You certainly wouldn't be folding any of those hands pre flop in those situations, except possibly the 44, depending on pay jumps, stacks at the table, etc. but 9 times out of 10, I'd never fold there pre.

Either you will, or you won't.

LordScanner

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December 19, 2012 - 7:13 am

Thanks for the replies. I do play quite a few 9 handed SNGs so I have spent quite a bit of time thinking about what I could have done differently.

The hands did seem standard. As for the 44 it was folded to me on the button, I had 12-13 BBs so it was an easy shove, and I still think that it was/should have been a very tough call by the BB with 55.

So the only thing that comes to mind is that I should have upped the agg level before becoming short stacked. Taken slight more marginal spots as opposed to not moving much. The 6-max was particularly annoying as the prize pool was bigger, stacks were similar when we were 5 handed (600-900k) except for the CL on my left that had 1.6 mil, but no deal could be reached (one of the guys was so clueless that he thought he would get less money than he would if he busted in 5th). Total Prize Pool was about 89k (35k for 1st), and I got 6k for 5th.

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