Home
(0 votes) 
Hi guys,
Im sure I will be starting an intesting thread here, I have found myself in some very interesting spots lately holding AK & would like to get some feedback ideally from the Pro's but the more feedback the merrier to be honest.
I will post some hands & also as much detail as possible about the particular hand in question etc.
Before I post I will just add that my particular preference to this point with AK is to pretty much not fold unless crazy action in front of me.
Hand 1:
This was on the final table of the $109r which I satelited into by winning a $1 x3 turbo tournament that day. I managed to get to this point 5 handed from just 1 buy in & the prize jumps were really big considering my bankroll of only $1000 at the time.
1st 13.2k
2nd 9.8k
3rd 7.2k
4th 5.1k
5th 3.5k
My stats for this tournament are 22/21 with a 9.3 3bet. Villian's stats are 22/13 with a 10.1 3bet over 298 hands. With the short stack on 17bb & villian's absurd 50bb 3bet shove over my just over 2x open it puts me in a really disgusting spot.
We were also close to doing a chop at this point, the way things were going it was pretty much the short stack that was making a chop not possible.We had spoke about a chop & the tournament had been paused a few hands before.
Being this was the largest sum of money that I had ever been playing for, I went deep into the time bank in this spot & I felt we had the same hand a very large % of the time however I used to split profits with a friend & he was on the phone with me throughout the tournament & he felt really strong that a fold here was correct based on all the factors at the table. ICM, stacks, being 1 player away from a probable deal etc. I really did not know what was best here, In a usual buy in for me ($1-$20) I would snap call here at any stage of tournament pretty much.
I actually decided to pass this spot based more on my friends decision & the factors above.
Interesting spot & definately would love to hear thoughts.
Poker Stars $100+$9 No Limit Hold'em Tournament – t4000/t8000 Blinds + t800 – 5 players
TournamentPokerEdge.com Hand History Converter
Hero (CO): BB = 35.8, t286336
insfran (BTN): BB = 47.3, t378312
1989robin (SB): BB = 28.8, t230226
Visitor81 (BB): BB = 40.4, t322808
chelovek1986 (UTG): BB = 17.2, t137318
Pre Flop: (t16000) Hero is CO with A
K
1 fold, Hero raises to t16255, insfran raises to t377512 all in, 3 folds
Hand 2:
$2 x2 turbo 2k runners. 58 players left. My current position is 1/58 with just under 40bb.
Poker Stars $2.00+$0.20 No Limit Hold'em Tournament – t10000/t20000 Blinds + t2000 – 9 players
TournamentPokerEdge.com Hand History Converter
david1979zgz (MP1): BB = 5.6, t111336
zergling07 (MP2): BB = 13.1, t261827
Kobarov (CO): BB = 29.9, t598289
Bubuii (BTN): BB = 24.5, t490571
Hero (SB): BB = 37.9, t758976
adita3224 (BB): BB = 16.0, t319184
ganz76 (UTG): BB = 6.9, t137430
binishi19 (UTG+1): BB = 17.3, t345532
psierra (UTG+2): BB = 27.1, t542444
Pre Flop: (t48000) Hero is SB with A K
ganz76 raises to t135430 all in, 4 folds, Kobarov raises to t596289 all in, 1 fold, Hero raises to t756976 all in, 1 fold
Flop: (t1366008) 2 T 3 (3 players – 3 are all in)
Turn: (t1366008) 4 (3 players – 3 are all in)
River: (t1366008) 2
(3 players – 3 are all in)
Villans stats:
UTG: 29/14 over 7 hands
CO: 9/9 over 11 hands with 25% 3bet
My thoughts here are that I am obv snap re-iso shoving vs UTG 7bb shove. When CO shoves 30bb it presents a spot which is interesting. Going into the hand I am chip leader, I am very close to average stack with 18 left right now.
If I win the hand then I would be on 1.5 million chips with 56 left with 2nd place on 620k. 1.5 million in this tournament is around avergage stack at FT. If I lose the hand I am crippled to 6bb.
With it being a x2 turbo I find it very hard to even consider folding but is there any arguement here for folding given that we are likely to be flipping most of the time vs his range or have the same hand with a possibility of him having him having AQ or AJ
His iso range here for a 30bb is prob 77-JJ, AKs-ATs, AK-AJ. I would imagine he flats QQ, KK or AA to induce although sometimes people shove QQ & KK in these spots at low stakes.
I called here. UTG AQ, CO JJ.
Just wondering what people's thoughts are here with regards to these spots.
Cheers
Dan
I am contributing to the 'more feedback' rather than the 'pro feedback' here.
The first hand at the final table I don't see him making this play with AA or KK and so I think at worst you are slightly behind in a race vs 10 10, JJ or maybe QQ. He could well have AK, in fact I agree that this is still his most likely hand even though you already take 2 out the deck. The third thing is could he be shoving a weaker hand here? Actually I think this is possible. If he has looked to see that you are playing outside your comfort zone then he may be trying to exploit it here. The trouble with that reasoning is if someone is competent enough to do that then I can't see them 3betting for 50bbs. So I put his range now as 99+ (but probably excluding AA and KK, which I think he will be 3betting smaller) AK and possibly AQ. Against this range you are mostly racing and very rarely crushed so it then comes down to ICM and where you hope to finish. If you are desperate to get some more of the prizepool in a chop then I think probably a fold is best. If you decide that it might be worth taking a race here to win the tourney then probably a call. From what you have written then, I think the fold was correct.
In hand 2, Ganz's range is obviously going to be very wide, but the iso from Kobarov is a much stronger range. Your AK will play very well vs 2 smaller pairs, or even 1 smaller pair and 1 weaker ace. Also it is unlikely that either have AA or KK for the reason you gave with the iso as well as that you are holding a blocker to both. Even if you do come up against KK you still have a surprising amount of equity. So I think in terms of expected value a call here is absolutely fine. But, you are chip leader at the moment and have to decide if this gamble (and quite likely race) is worth it. If you win you are then a big chip lead and looking good for the final table, if you lose you are likely going out soon. If you fold you are still chip lead with a good shot at final table. I think folding or calling is fine and will again come down to whether you want to gamble for a big chip lead.
For what it's worth, without any real info in the villain, I think I am calling at the final table and probably calling in the second spot too. In both spots there isn't really enough play to assign anyone to a complete monster, which is what I'm looking for to fold the AK.
Lol I've been thinking about making a similar post for a while now. Almost every tourny I've been in where I've had a chance at significant $$, AK has been my bustout hand. It's got to the stage now where I almost dread getting AK at critical times deep in tournaments. I'm being completely results oriented of course, as it's always been a flip, but it makes you question whether you want to take these high variance spots with so much on the line.
Less than 20 bigs these spots are no-brainer calls for me, but I have the most trouble in situations like the ones you've given where you are quite deep and another big stack shoves on you. If you are fairly certain your opponent has QQ or JJ, should you be risking most of your stack on a flip? Interested to get the views of the pros too.
October 6, 2010
Offline
runningouts said:
I am contributing to the 'more feedback' rather than the 'pro feedback' here.
The first hand at the final table I don't see him making this play with AA or KK and so I think at worst you are slightly behind in a race vs 10 10, JJ or maybe QQ. He could well have AK, in fact I agree that this is still his most likely hand even though you already take 2 out the deck. The third thing is could he be shoving a weaker hand here? Actually I think this is possible. If he has looked to see that you are playing outside your comfort zone then he may be trying to exploit it here. The trouble with that reasoning is if someone is competent enough to do that then I can't see them 3betting for 50bbs. So I put his range now as 99+ (but probably excluding AA and KK, which I think he will be 3betting smaller) AK and possibly AQ. Against this range you are mostly racing and very rarely crushed so it then comes down to ICM and where you hope to finish. If you are desperate to get some more of the prizepool in a chop then I think probably a fold is best. If you decide that it might be worth taking a race here to win the tourney then probably a call. From what you have written then, I think the fold was correct.
In hand 2, Ganz's range is obviously going to be very wide, but the iso from Kobarov is a much stronger range. Your AK will play very well vs 2 smaller pairs, or even 1 smaller pair and 1 weaker ace. Also it is unlikely that either have AA or KK for the reason you gave with the iso as well as that you are holding a blocker to both. Even if you do come up against KK you still have a surprising amount of equity. So I think in terms of expected value a call here is absolutely fine. But, you are chip leader at the moment and have to decide if this gamble (and quite likely race) is worth it. If you win you are then a big chip lead and looking good for the final table, if you lose you are likely going out soon. If you fold you are still chip lead with a good shot at final table. I think folding or calling is fine and will again come down to whether you want to gamble for a big chip lead.
For what it's worth, without any real info in the villain, I think I am calling at the final table and probably calling in the second spot too. In both spots there isn't really enough play to assign anyone to a complete monster, which is what I'm looking for to fold the AK.
I think the second post is a bit of an easier call – i mean even with the CL, in a 2xturbo we're not really gonna see premium hands that often so i'd call here every time.. c/o does have AJs+ in his range..
The 1st post is actually pretty interesting, not just b/c of the strange play by villain but b/c of your own situation, how you got there, your roll at the time etc..
All in all i'd think to myself that 1) all of these guys are probably good if not very good players 2) they probably know i'm out of my comfort zone 3) i've already got a nice payday
I tend to take more chances against players i know are better than me, and if i ever have the opportunity to make a 109r FT i think i'd probably get it in here and take the flip! if we win then we have 71BBs anad a pretty decent CL.. this would also make our position a whole lot more favourable if we do go into a chop.
July 3, 2010
Offline
Hand 1: Pretty lol bad shove from the BB no matter what he's holding here. If moving up 2 spots is huge to you I guess you can fold. I can't bring myself to fold here.
one thing that I've learned from this site is play to WIN!!!….I am with coolers on this one…have a hard time folding a premium 5 handed to what looks like a squeeze especially if the villian looks like he is trying to exploit the deal talk to get a higher chop….for me it is a call every time…..gl all
Most Users Ever Online: 2780
Currently Online:
52 Guest(s)
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Top Posters:
bennymacca: 2616
Foucault: 2067
folding_aces_pre_yo: 1133
praetor: 1033
theginger45: 924
P-aire 146: 832
Turbulence: 768
The Riceman: 731
duggs: 591
florianm1: 588
Newest Members:
Tillery999
sdmathis89
ne0x00
adrianvaida2525
Anteeater
Laggro
Forum Stats:
Groups: 4
Forums: 24
Topics: 12705
Posts: 75003
Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 1063
Members: 12008
Moderators: 2
Admins: 5
Administrators: RonFezBuddy, Killingbird, Tournament Poker Edge Staff, ttwist, Carlos
Moderators: sitelock, sitelock_1
