Home
(0 votes) 
October 21, 2012
Offline
He was 37/23 and had raised 4/4 buttons.
Merge Network $1K Gtd – [Deep] No Limit Hold'em Tournament – t300.00/t600.00 Blinds + t60.00 – 8 players
TournamentPokerEdge.com Hand History Converter
CO: BB = 40.3, t24202
BTN: BB = 80.8, t48487
Hero (SB): BB = 34.4, t20623
BB: BB = 27.1, t16290
UTG: BB = 37.2, t22342
UTG+1: BB = 27.5, t16490
MP1: BB = 90.2, t54105
MP2: BB = 42.6, t25552
Pre Flop: (t1380) Hero is SB with 9
T
5 folds, BTN raises to t1200.00, Hero raises to t2500.00, 1 fold, BTN calls t1300
Flop: (t6080) 8 6
K (2 players)
Hero bets t2500.00, BTN calls t2500
Turn: (t11080) 8
(2 players)
Hero bets t4600.00, BTN calls t4600
River: (t20280) 5 (2 players)
Hero bets t10963 all in, BTN calls t10963
I planned to go all the way with this hand because he had shown up with all kinds of crap before. He had flatted a 3bet from me here before with A9o. All my bets were kinda small because I wanted to set up a river shove. Should I have bet bigger and set up a turn shove because I only had 35bbs?
Better line?
PF 3000
Flop 4000 into 7000
Turn shove 13000 into 15000
Or should I not be going broke with a bluff here against a weak field? They played bad but I didnt have many spots because they flatted my 3x opens from all over the table sometimes even multiway and floated a lot.
October 21, 2012
Offline
to answer my own question, another line could be flatting or maybe min 3betting and then check calling on a flop like this. that way we're not out of the game if he cant find a fold with K5o and he may slow down any way after being exposed.
On the next orbit, we will then be short enough to 3bet shove. I think this gives us 2 chances instead of 1.
November 12, 2012
Offline
with your read of him and previous hand experience with him, i dont mind the line of playing back at his button open but i dont think i would say im going all the way with this hand no matter what. even if he is crazy he has position and a bunch of chips, so this spots screams caution to me after he flats the flop. i probably check/fold turn. i dont think the betting bigger line would be a better cuz that looks really bluffy imo.
i think your answer is a good idea. it might also give u the chance to check/raise the flop and take it down there if u min 3b pre
October 9, 2012
Offline
Gotta agree with Will on this one.
You got 35bb on what u describe as a table full of bad players and you decide to make a high variance play against a bad player.
Alarm bells shoulda rung with the flat pre flop and on the flop. The guys obviously got some decent equity in the hand and is so unlikely to fold to river shove here.Your second line may have worked if he was on worse than the range i believe he's on here. Either way, no reason to gamble so hard in this position.
I feel he was probably on a set of 6's or 99 to QQ .. or maybe even KQ KJ .. I reckon AK woulda raised on turn but obviously pure speculation with such a poor player.
July 7, 2012
Offline
Couple of points:-
1) if your gonna 3 bet OOP (bluffing or for value) i think you need to make it a in the range of 2.5 – 2.8x so in this example in the region of 3000 – 3300, this reduces villains pot odds for calling to 'see a flop' and implies from the get go that you are serious about the hand.
2) If you 3 bet bigger pre, a smaller cbet is much more effective
3) A fish with a made hand is never folding, once you've 2 barrelled and he's still stationing (and you haven't improve) give up, no matter how painful it might feel.
If you wanted to run a different line with this hand you could consider:- calling pre, flat flop, c/r turn, shove rvr – this line looks super strong. All that said, running any bluff line needs to a) tell a convincing story b) have an opponent capable of thinking it through, station fish are not in this catagory and should only be pounded when you have it.
October 21, 2012
Offline
i def like a smallish 3bet pre to iso and then just check call down.
July 7, 2012
Offline
loxxii said:
i def like a smallish 3bet pre to iso and then just check call down.
To iso? Villain raised from BTN and Hero 3bet from BB, there was noone left to act. And why would you 3bet to take control of the pot and then immediately give it up again. Surely the purpose of our 3bet here is to a) take down the pot pre flop a decent % of the time b) if called to take the pot down on Flop with cbet a decent % of time c) to tell villain he can't just walk all over our BB.
October 21, 2012
Offline
Nope I was in SB. It would be similar to checking back a flop. The small 3bet is rarely winning pre and if you cbet then you find yourself in this spot which I am trying to avoid. I think your options here are 1. cbet and give up if you miss on the turn or 2. check call down so that you get to see all streets and his hole cards for about the same price as a bigger 3bet and cbet. If he shows up with 23o here and has to show it down, that might make him stop raising so much.
Im not saying it's the best line. I am just considering an alternate line if you dont like giving up on similar turns to this one a lot of the time. Another option is to let him keep taking the blinds until you are down to a reshove stack and pick up a hand you are willing to go with.
July 3, 2010
Offline
3 bet larger and delayed c-bet is an option. We're not really raising this hand for value OOP but we're sizing such that no one will ever fold to us pre. Don't like that.
The turn is not a good card for us.
This just isn't a good 3 barrel board. There were no draws out there (we had the only one, really) so he's calling down with showdown value, not with any type of drawing hand.
Overall it's just a really unnecessary spot. If he's this loose, and maybe a fish, why not flat 100% of his CO and Hijack opens from the button and outplay IP?
June 1, 2012
Offline
Turbulence said:
3) A fish with a made hand is never folding, once you've 2 barrelled and he's still stationing (and you haven't improve) give up, no matter how painful it might feel.
———————————————–
I play a lot of these sort of buy in and this is definately the way I would go as well. I might even be inclined to give up after he calls your Cbet as there are so many better spots in these fishy fields and this sort of player can't even fold Ace high a lot of the time. It's taken a long time to force myself to give up vs these cs fish when they can't fold anything, especially OOP when you can't see if they are ready to give up on the hand before you barrel. For me, there's not much that's harder than having to fold after barelling 70+% of my stack without a made hand or decent draw, but after getting called down by bottom pair and A high so often, it's made a huge diff in my results. Again, this is only really applicable vs fishy players as some of them just don't recognise lines that decent players will.
October 21, 2012
Offline
Yep. There seems to be countless lines to take here. The only one I dont like is the one in the OP.
May 30, 2012
Offline
FkCoolers said:
3 bet larger and delayed c-bet is an option. We're not really raising this hand for value OOP but we're sizing such that no one will ever fold to us pre. Don't like that.
The turn is not a good card for us.
This just isn't a good 3 barrel board. There were no draws out there (we had the only one, really) so he's calling down with showdown value, not with any type of drawing hand.
Overall it's just a really unnecessary spot. If he's this loose, and maybe a fish, why not flat 100% of his CO and Hijack opens from the button and outplay IP?
Coolers nailed it.
I think if he is an awful fish id much rather flat and keep the SPR higher, allows us to outplay him easier, as we still get value when we flop well, we can push him off his wider range easier if he slows down, and we can get away from nightmare flops that smash him with relative ease.
September 29, 2012
Offline
Preflop: If you want to 3b OOP, you have to raise a little more. If I were the button, I would fold about 0% to that sizing of 3bet.
Flop: I like the c-bet. I might make it slightly larger, but I don't think there's anything wrong with your sizing. If he's folding to 3k, he's probably folding to 2.5k here.
Turn: I think this is a horrible turn to double barrel. It changes nothing. If he thought he was good on the flop, he has to feel he is still good.
River: If he called two bets and a harmless card falls on the river, I don't think he's folding.
June 7, 2012
Offline
the min 3 bet guarntees a call, i assume you wanted to take it down pre most of the time?
Upswing potential is huge
October 21, 2012
Offline
I think I just wanted the BB out of the hand. I like a flat now after watching CCuster911 flat without worrying about the blinds calling behind because they will usually fold their weak range to the cbet anyway.
Question: For those who prefer 3betting bigger and then cbetting. I assume you are barrelling on a favorable turn like T, 9, J, 7, Q or A. If you do and you miss, do you shove or give up on the river?
July 3, 2010
Offline
The answer to your preflop question and your post flop question is something you already asked in the OP.
You should not be going broke here in such a weak field.
Most Users Ever Online: 2780
Currently Online:
31 Guest(s)
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Top Posters:
bennymacca: 2616
Foucault: 2067
folding_aces_pre_yo: 1133
praetor: 1033
theginger45: 924
P-aire 146: 832
Turbulence: 768
The Riceman: 731
duggs: 591
florianm1: 588
Newest Members:
Tillery999
sdmathis89
ne0x00
adrianvaida2525
Anteeater
Laggro
Forum Stats:
Groups: 4
Forums: 24
Topics: 12705
Posts: 75003
Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 1063
Members: 12008
Moderators: 2
Admins: 5
Administrators: RonFezBuddy, Killingbird, Tournament Poker Edge Staff, ttwist, Carlos
Moderators: sitelock, sitelock_1
