View Plans & Pricing

If you are signed in and are seeing this message, please be sure you have selected a user name in My Profile. The forum requires it.
A A A
Search

— Forum Scope —




— Match —





— Forum Options —





Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters

Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 (0 votes) 
sp_TopicIcon
BvB shoving and final table ICM
GunnJD
Midstakes Master
Members
Forum Posts: 131
Member Since:
August 10, 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
1
September 17, 2015 - 2:41 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

At what point should I pay more attention to ICM than nash ranges? 

I had a particularly passive final table tonight, and didn’t temper my shoving ranges. It would often fold to me in the small blind, and even before I was around ~10bb, the big blind was folding often. 

Should I be passing up +ev shoves like this? Is the biggest factor whether or not I’m the shortest stack?

Thank you!

theginger45

TPE Pro
Members
Forum Posts: 924
Member Since:
August 25, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
2
October 9, 2015 - 12:43 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Stack distribution is the biggest factor, yes. If you’re the shortest stack and there’s no reasonable chance of someone else busting before you (i.e. you have 12bb and the next shortest has 35bb) then going with Nash ranges/exploitative cEV ranges isn’t going to hurt you much. But if you have 12bb and another guy has 3bb, you should be way, way tighter than cEV Nash ranges.

There’s a lot of value still attached to having fold equity – so putting in the last bet still gives you some leeway – but especially when you’re the one calling it off, you need to be factoring in all the stacks around you before deciding on how much value there is in accumulating further chips. The shorter other players are, the more you gain from staying where you are.

Get yourself a copy of HoldemResources Calculator – this will basically solve a lot of your ICM queries. It can do cEV Nash, cEV exploits, ICM Nash and ICM exploits, and you’ll be surprised some of the crazy dynamics that happen when you have a reasonable idea of how other players are going to react to ICM situations.

Forum Timezone: America/New_York

Most Users Ever Online: 2780

Currently Online:
35 Guest(s)

Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)

Top Posters:

bennymacca: 2616

Foucault: 2067

folding_aces_pre_yo: 1133

praetor: 1033

theginger45: 924

P-aire 146: 832

Turbulence: 768

The Riceman: 731

duggs: 591

florianm1: 588

Newest Members:

Tillery999

sdmathis89

ne0x00

adrianvaida2525

Anteeater

Laggro

Forum Stats:

Groups: 4

Forums: 24

Topics: 12705

Posts: 75003

 

Member Stats:

Guest Posters: 1063

Members: 12008

Moderators: 2

Admins: 5

Administrators: RonFezBuddy, Killingbird, Tournament Poker Edge Staff, ttwist, Carlos

Moderators: sitelock, sitelock_1