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another ss
adog26
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March 24, 2011 - 2:25 pm
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No reads, only 7 hands. What are we doing on the riv?

 

 

 

Full Tilt Poker Super Stack $14K Guarantee No Limit Hold'em Tournament – t40/t80 Blinds – 9 players
TournamentPokerEdge.com Hand History Converter

dasole (CO): t5430 67.88 BBs
KazZateL (BTN): t3050 38.12 BBs
Paturco (SB): t3814 47.67 BBs
cashmaker81 (BB): t5320 66.50 BBs
seadafritta (UTG): t5583 69.79 BBs
jamoneosocio (UTG+1): t6825 85.31 BBs
bjopap (UTG+2): t4710 58.88 BBs
deepdowndave (MP1): t5125 64.06 BBs
LarioS69 (MP2): t7995 99.94 BBs

Pre Flop: (t120) cashmaker81 is BB with T of diamonds 3 of clubs
2 folds, bjopap calls t80, deepdowndave calls t80, 4 folds, cashmaker81 checks

Flop: (t280) T of hearts 7 of diamonds 3 of spades (3 players)
cashmaker81 checks, bjopap bets t160, deepdowndave folds, cashmaker81 raises to t560, bjopap calls t400

Turn: (t1400) K of hearts (2 players)
cashmaker81 bets t960, bjopap calls t960

River: (t3320) 7 of clubs (2 players)

checkraizer1
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March 24, 2011 - 5:04 pm
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I might fire the river again.  It just looks like a draw to me.  And if he has the 10 its probably a chop.  I cant see much that beats you here.  If he had 67 or 78 I cant see him continuing past the turn unless he just happened to have 67 or 78hh.  Thinking he missed his draw or it chop-chop time.

wilmont
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March 24, 2011 - 6:37 pm
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This early in he probably missed a heart draw. Could have A7hh but don't see him calling you down with much else unless its AA-JJ. Bet 999 on the river and he probably folds.

hawkeyeK9
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March 24, 2011 - 11:30 pm
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Small blocker bet on the river is the only play here. You dont wanna check/call a big bet, and if you fire big to represent, you can easily lose chips or even get raised and vomit in your mouth a bit. Sick river but that is the way it goes sometimes.

slimb0
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March 25, 2011 - 1:13 pm
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I think if your going to fire the river because you think its a chop than theres merit in check/calling where the hearts and straightdraws missed, at least then you give him a chance to bluff at the pot if its not a chop and and if you are chopping theres no value being lost by check calling anyways.

 

A blocker bet allows him to shove as bluffs which would put you in a hard spot or allows him to shove hands that you chop with because he also thinks he can get you off a chop; also putting  you to a tough decision. Also a blocker bet makes him want to bluff less if he is behind. I doubt hes overbet jamming the river with a bluff and if he has a ten that chops with you he's just going to bet it nominally isn't he? He may even check behind with a Ten.

isaacjames
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March 25, 2011 - 1:44 pm
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slimb0 said:

I think if your going to fire the river because you think its a chop than theres merit in check/calling where the hearts and straightdraws missed, at least then you give him a chance to bluff at the pot if its not a chop and and if you are chopping theres no value being lost by check calling anyways.

 

A blocker bet allows him to shove as bluffs which would put you in a hard spot or allows him to shove hands that you chop with because he also thinks he can get you off a chop; also putting  you to a tough decision. Also a blocker bet makes him want to bluff less if he is behind. I doubt hes overbet jamming the river with a bluff and if he has a ten that chops with you he's just going to bet it nominally isn't he? He may even check behind with a Ten.

I am with slimb0 here, Check call is the play IMO.  I am not sure that he would call the check raise with a 2 hearts on on  one heart flop a ton of the time so I am more inclined to put him on  one pair hands like 99 88 JJ, 77 66.

lespaulgman
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March 25, 2011 - 1:53 pm
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I think a step back here may be in order. Do we really think that in the face of a substantial check/raise on the flop this guy is going to play with no made hand? Given stack sizes and the tournament you are in, I would be far more inclined to think that he is holding a T there, or 55-99 and doesn't think that a T is in your range. A lot of players will limp suited connectors at this level which means that 89 is in there, but I just don't think that it is a big enough part of his range to be losing sleep over. I am not surprised that he called the turn bet either as given the pre-flop action I don't expect the K or the Heart to really change the texture of the board. I would suspect more often than not you are looking at a T (JT, QT, 9T that sort of thing) and he just doesn't belive that the BB connected. So many players know that limpers get picked on. I think I bet hard on the river here and am happy to have him call. If he has a 7 here, gg us. I think you get value from so much of his range that I punish him for his limpy antics.

adog26
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March 25, 2011 - 2:23 pm
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lespaulgman said:

I think a step back here may be in order. Do we really think that in the face of a substantial check/raise on the flop this guy is going to play with no made hand? Given stack sizes and the tournament you are in, I would be far more inclined to think that he is holding a T there, or 55-99 and doesn't think that a T is in your range. A lot of players will limp suited connectors at this level which means that 89 is in there, but I just don't think that it is a big enough part of his range to be losing sleep over. I am not surprised that he called the turn bet either as given the pre-flop action I don't expect the K or the Heart to really change the texture of the board. I would suspect more often than not you are looking at a T (JT, QT, 9T that sort of thing) and he just doesn't belive that the BB connected. So many players know that limpers get picked on. I think I bet hard on the river here and am happy to have him call. If he has a 7 here, gg us. I think you get value from so much of his range that I punish him for his limpy antics.

 

 

 

 

Hmm, I'm not sure what part of his range we get value from once that 7 falls on the riv except pairs like 44-66 that he gets stubborn with or A3hh which seems unlikely

slimb0
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March 25, 2011 - 2:33 pm
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adog26 said:

lespaulgman said:

I think a step back here may be in order. Do we really think that in the face of a substantial check/raise on the flop this guy is going to play with no made hand? Given stack sizes and the tournament you are in, I would be far more inclined to think that he is holding a T there, or 55-99 and doesn't think that a T is in your range. A lot of players will limp suited connectors at this level which means that 89 is in there, but I just don't think that it is a big enough part of his range to be losing sleep over. I am not surprised that he called the turn bet either as given the pre-flop action I don't expect the K or the Heart to really change the texture of the board. I would suspect more often than not you are looking at a T (JT, QT, 9T that sort of thing) and he just doesn't belive that the BB connected. So many players know that limpers get picked on. I think I bet hard on the river here and am happy to have him call. If he has a 7 here, gg us. I think you get value from so much of his range that I punish him for his limpy antics.

 

 

 

 

Hmm, I'm not sure what part of his range we get value from once that 7 falls on the riv except pairs like 44-66 that he gets stubborn with or A3hh which seems unlikely

Ya its very small if there is a portion of his range that were value betting against.

FkCoolers
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March 25, 2011 - 9:18 pm
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Check/Call or Check/Fold if you have strong read.

If we bet we don't get called by worse hands and I don't think the dude double floated pocket pairs here ever so I don't really include them in his range.

Seems like a strong Tx a lot and we got counterfeited. 

G0liath
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March 26, 2011 - 5:50 am
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I also like the check/call. By doing this your asking him to represent the 7 and bet with his air. Winning a lot of value with your mediocre hand which is now pretty much a bluff catcher anyway.

If you bet, I don’t see a hand he has that your getting value from. Especially since you checkraise flop bet turn, bet river.

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