Home
(0 votes) 
January 10, 2015
Offline
First off, apologies for the format, I can't figure out how to work the hand history converter on this site. If anyone could walk me through it I would really appreciate it, as I hope to use this feature much more to improve my play.
Both the guy who 3bet and the guy who 4bet had been pretty taggy and their HUD stats reflected this, the guy who 4bet I definitely put on a monster hand like AA or KK, so I thought this was a pretty bad spot for me to be getting in and that I would be a pretty big underdog. What do you guys think?
PokerStars Hand #130194700211: Tournament #1137322248, $0.45+$0.05 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level IX (200/400) - 2015/02/09 13:42:04 CET [2015/02/09 7:42:04 ET] Table '1137322248 4' 9-max Seat #1 is the button Seat 1: remusz1997 (8010 in chips) Seat 2: kozelj431 (5585 in chips) Seat 3: yfoolson (5447 in chips) Seat 4: mgl_tamir (9284 in chips) Seat 5: Seenoby (12895 in chips) Seat 6: dinas2001 (6230 in chips) Seat 7: franki69569 (5576 in chips) Seat 8: h0rd3l (3075 in chips) Seat 9: Geralt90210 (4149 in chips) remusz1997: posts the ante 50 kozelj431: posts the ante 50 yfoolson: posts the ante 50 mgl_tamir: posts the ante 50 Seenoby: posts the ante 50 dinas2001: posts the ante 50 franki69569: posts the ante 50 h0rd3l: posts the ante 50 Geralt90210: posts the ante 50 kozelj431: posts small blind 200 yfoolson: posts big blind 400 *** HOLE CARDS *** Dealt to Geralt90210 [Ks Ad] mgl_tamir: folds Seenoby: raises 415 to 815 dinas2001: raises 785 to 1600 franki69569: raises 3926 to 5526 and is all-in h0rd3l: folds Geralt90210: folds remusz1997: folds kozelj431: folds yfoolson: folds Seenoby: folds dinas2001: calls 3926 *** FLOP *** [6h 2c 7c] *** TURN *** [6h 2c 7c] [2s] *** RIVER *** [6h 2c 7c 2s] [2d] *** SHOW DOWN *** dinas2001: shows [Jc Js] (a full house, Deuces full of Jacks) franki69569: shows [Kc Kh] (a full house, Deuces full of Kings) franki69569 collected 12917 from pot *** SUMMARY *** Total pot 12917 | Rake 0 Board [6h 2c 7c 2s 2d]
January 10, 2015
Offline
Nevermind, seems the hand history came out quite nicely!
February 8, 2015
Offline
CL at the table opens, gets 3bet and then 4bet relatively early position by players noted as somewhat tight. I fold here and try to not grimace too much if an ace hits.
Obviously you folded as well and put the 4bet on what turned out to be the correct range.
What range do we call with here?
TPE Pro
December 6, 2012
Offline
“Obviously you folded as well and put the 4bet on what turned out to be the correct range. “
How do you know he put him on the correct range?
January 10, 2015
Offline
I said in my OP that I put him on KK+ and he did turn over KK.
February 8, 2015
Offline
Sorry, obviously and correct are unnecessarily aggressive terms and don’t add context. Should have read “As played, you folded and the 4bet player had the range you assumed (KK+)”
Geralt mentioned that both the 3bet player and 4bet player were “pretty taggy”. To deviate from the as-played hand, if the 4bet player folds instead of raising, do we then 4bet shove into CL (at table) open and tight early position 3bet?
I think I’m shoving here and my tournament is over (as played assuming 3bet calls). This may or may not be correct, but what ranges should we be shoving here?
February 2, 2015
Offline
I’ll take a shot at it.
I think what he’s getting at is that I’m not sure you can put him on KK or AA only here without more info.
He essentially has a min raise from chip leader and a very small 3-bet in front of him. Flatting is a bad idea given the stack sizes and number of players left to act. Add to this that he can’t really 4-bet without committing himself and this makes it a shove/fold decision for him.
I think you are correct to assume that it’s going to be a top notch hand when he makes this move and AA/KK are definitely in his range here, but I also wouldn’t be surprised to see him flip hands like QQ, JJ, AKs, and even AQs. He may have construed the bet sizing as weaker hands and thought he had enough fold equity to push them out.
If you had KK here, would you still put him on KK or AA? Would you call?
January 10, 2015
Offline
Assuming the 4bet folded I am usually going to 4bet shove here with AK. Based on my read of the player I would have him on AT+ 99+ and I would say I still have a decent amount of fold equity, given I am basically forcing him to flip me most of the time, and (assuming he cared or noticed) I had a rather tight image.
With the ISO 4bet shove from such an early position from quite a tight player I think I will only be calling with KK+ here to be honest.
TPE Pro
December 6, 2012
Offline
That's right, DT. Suppose Villain's range were actually {TT+, AQs+, AKo}. KK is still in that range, so the fact that he had KK doesn't tell you whether or not that range or the range you gave or any other range that contains KK is correct. Just because he had KK doesn't mean he wouldn't have done the same thing with weaker hands had he had those. To be clear, this isn't an opinion on Hero's actual play, just on the claim that the results prove Hero's read.
January 10, 2015
Offline
Foucault said:
That's right, DT. Suppose Villain's range were actually {TT+, AQs+, AKo}. KK is still in that range, so the fact that he had KK doesn't tell you whether or not that range or the range you gave or any other range that contains KK is correct. Just because he had KK doesn't mean he wouldn't have done the same thing with weaker hands had he had those. To be clear, this isn't an opinion on Hero's actual play, just on the claim that the results prove Hero's read.
Interesting way to look at it, and thanks for the comments guys. It's true he could have played AQs+ or AKo here in a similar manner, and let's assume he does, given that (based on my limited amount of information) 3bet is very likely to call here, I am still most likely to fold given I don't like my chances playing AKo three ways when taking both of their ranges in to consideration.
Do you think I was right to fold here Foucault? What hands are you calling with here?
Most Users Ever Online: 2780
Currently Online:
18 Guest(s)
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Top Posters:
bennymacca: 2616
Foucault: 2067
folding_aces_pre_yo: 1133
praetor: 1033
theginger45: 924
P-aire 146: 832
Turbulence: 768
The Riceman: 731
duggs: 591
florianm1: 588
Newest Members:
Tillery999
sdmathis89
ne0x00
adrianvaida2525
Anteeater
Laggro
Forum Stats:
Groups: 4
Forums: 24
Topics: 12705
Posts: 75003
Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 1063
Members: 12008
Moderators: 2
Admins: 5
Administrators: RonFezBuddy, Killingbird, Tournament Poker Edge Staff, ttwist, Carlos
Moderators: sitelock, sitelock_1
