Hey guys,
After watching bigdogs showdown value vs betting for value video i have been trying to focus a little more on these spots. As many of you found out today in the TPE league tourney, im not the best player out there, so im going to have to ask that you forgive me for a couple things in this hand:
1) I didnt c-bet this flop—-> This is terrible considering the strength i showed pre flop (IMHO)
2) I didnt bet the turn either
So I will give you a little bit of background. Im new to the table, and have been there for 10 hands, ive played only 2 1 being AK wich i cbet the flop and took it down and the other being BvB. The OR has played 4 or 5 of the 10 hands since ive been seated, but hasnt shown down any monsters.
Poker Stars $4.00 No Limit Hold'em Tournament – t30/t60 Blinds – 8 players
TournamentPokerEdge.com Hand History Converter
UTG: t4298 71.63 BBs
UTG+1: t2040 34 BBs
MP1: t3585 59.75 BBs
MP2: t8613 143.55 BBs
Hero (CO): t5085 84.75 BBs
BTN: t1490 24.83 BBs
SB: t2463 41.05 BBs
BB: t2257 37.62 BBs
Pre Flop: (t90) Hero is CO with K A
1 fold, UTG+1 calls t60, 1 fold, MP2 raises to t120, Hero raises to t260, 4 folds, MP2 calls t140
Flop: (t670) 6 T J (2 players)
MP2 checks, Hero checks
Turn: (t670) 6 (2 players)
MP2 checks, Hero checks
River: (t670) A (2 players)
MP2 bets t300, Hero calls t300
Final Pot: t1270
MP2 shows 5s 2s (a pair of Sixes)
Hero shows Kh Ah (two pair, Aces and Sixes)
Hero wins t1270
What do you guys think
First off your preflop 3 bet is very weak. You both have so many chips here it's important to put in a bigger preflop bet because you want to build somewhat of a pot here before the flop having over 84BBs to where you can get a lot of money in if you hit big.
I'd raise much bigger at least 3x his size but probably more like 4-5x just because a re-raise of his 120 to 260 could induce more players in the pot left to act and if he's got a decent hand in a lower limit game he probably will call 480-600 chips.
I'd still lead out on this flop and then go from there. With his particular hand (please try not to show us) you likely just get a fold which those few hundred extra chips you could of got preflop might of been the most value but other times if he peels a street an Ax type hand or somewhat of a draw then you can trend accordingly and if you hit an ace or king on the flop then hopefully he came along with the weaker ace which will allow you to get way more value since you boosted the pot preflop which is necessary when stacks are this deep.
Yeah my 3 bet sizing is something Im working on. My typical open is usually in the 2.2 to 2.5x range so i have generally been keeping my 3 bet size somewhere in that range. Only reason I do this is that I figure I can 3 bet lighter without risking a ton of my chips, but still showing strength. And maybe 3 betting lighter in smaller tourneys isnt a good idea but, thats my only justification I guess for the smaller size, I'm definately open to more input on that for sure, and I will be checking out 3 betting vids, as i think there is one in the TPE Theory section.
I did check the box to show results as a spoiler but it didnt work out lol
Thanks for the advice!
i think that utg+1 is weak since he just limped and mp2 just min raises, which to me seems weak also. your 3-bet is def. to small should have been around 300-360 imo. you said you dont like to risk to many chips, but if the raise is closer to 3x then the pot is bigger when u take it down. and on flop i would c-bet and prolly TID, that way your not tryin to guess what he has. that flop is not to bad for you. u have a gutshot, 2 overs and backdoor nut flush draw. with all of that being said u still won, but the more cards u let him see the more chances he gets lucky(if he had a 6). well i hope this helps, gl to u at the tables
The UTG+1 limp is pretty standard stuff for this level so I don't worry too much about it, what creeps me out in this hand though is the min-raise from the MP guy. I am not going to fold my AKs here, but I also think that I am going to take a more cautious line here and see if I can clobber what looks like a big hand. I would be more inclined to call the min-raise and get the original limper to see if he wants to come along (this early in a tourney I treat AK like a draw so I want to get in and see cards cheap). As for flop on, i don't mind it at all. I think that is pretty standard way to play. I am not folding to that flop and I really want to see some free cards. The board pairing with no real action doesn't bother me at all either.
If you do choose to 3bet this hand though the gents are right, gotta bet it like you mean it and let them know you mean business.
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