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(0 votes) 
January 29, 2014
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Hey guys,
Just played this hand and managed to get myself into a spot with it. Not really sure on the river which is why I’m looking for opinions here.
A couple of considerations for the hand, at the time my stats were 30% vpip/22% pfr/6% 3bet. Villain was new to the table (played about 10 hands), but we have 100 hands on him, his stats are 11/11/3. On the river, we have 8 seconds of time bank left (not sure if thats relevant or not really. We are past rebuy/add on stage of the tourney and there are 500ish left with 99 paid so ICM/bubbles etc do not play much part in the hand.
PokerStars Hand #133139142162: Tournament #1182147025, $5.00+$0.50 USD Hold’em No Limit – Level XI (125/250) – 2015/04/03 18:21:30 WET [2015/04/03 13:21:30 ET]
Table ‘1182147025 36’ 9-max Seat #5 is the button
Seat 1: Pikey2003 (33944 in chips)
Seat 2: cristianoem (4500 in chips)
Seat 3: PRAM2009 (5275 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 4: ajc65 (10835 in chips)
Seat 5: Tydarax (36400 in chips)
Seat 6: dapper4 (9907 in chips)
Seat 7: Tr!pleeeee (23343 in chips)
Seat 8: FLORENSIA (4550 in chips)
Seat 9: Akhi152 (13818 in chips)
Pikey2003: posts the ante 30
cristianoem: posts the ante 30
PRAM2009: posts the ante 30
ajc65: posts the ante 30
Tydarax: posts the ante 30
dapper4: posts the ante 30
Tr!pleeeee: posts the ante 30
FLORENSIA: posts the ante 30
Akhi152: posts the ante 30
dapper4: posts small blind 125
Tr!pleeeee: posts big blind 250
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Pikey2003 [As Ah]
FLORENSIA: folds
Akhi152: folds
Pikey2003: raises 250 to 500
cristianoem: folds
PRAM2009: folds
ajc65: folds
Tydarax: folds
dapper4: calls 375
Tr!pleeeee: calls 250
*** FLOP *** [5d 9h 4c]
dapper4: checks
Tr!pleeeee: checks
Pikey2003: bets 700
dapper4: calls 700
Tr!pleeeee: raises 1425 to 2125
Pikey2003: calls 1425
dapper4: folds
*** TURN *** [5d 9h 4c] [6h]
Tr!pleeeee: bets 4368
Pikey2003: calls 4368
*** RIVER *** [5d 9h 4c 6h] [Kc]
Tr!pleeeee: bets 16320 and is all-in
Pikey2003: folds [As Ah]
Uncalled bet (16320) returned to Tr!pleeeee
Tr!pleeeee collected 15456 from pot
Tr!pleeeee: doesn’t show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 15456 | Rake 0
Board [5d 9h 4c 6h Kc]
Seat 1: Pikey2003 folded on the River
Seat 2: cristianoem folded before Flop (didn’t bet)
Seat 3: PRAM2009 folded before Flop (didn’t bet)
Seat 4: ajc65 folded before Flop (didn’t bet)
Seat 5: Tydarax (button) folded before Flop (didn’t bet)
Seat 6: dapper4 (small blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 7: Tr!pleeeee (big blind) collected (15456)
Seat 8: FLORENSIA folded before Flop (didn’t bet)
Seat 9: Akhi152 folded before Flop (didn’t bet)
Given how active we have been at the table, I think SB (30 hands at the table) calls with most of his range, which prices BB into the pot. The flop is an easy Cbet, this can hit both their ranges but we want action from most hands don’t we? When BB check raises I’m not sure what to make of it, draws pairs 2 pairs sets and air are all in his range.
The board gets wetter on the turn with a 2nd heart which also completes draws. Pair plus backdoor draws on the flop may have improved, but I think my hand is good a fair % of the time. I think it’s reasonable to call and evaluate river, are we only getting called by better if we raise?
In my eyes the off suit king on the river is insignificant, there aren’t many (if any?) Kx hands which make 2 pair that would check raise flop, he shouldnt have KK as played (should he?), So when villain shoves river what do we do? I feel like this is one of those miles ahead/miles behind in this spot. As I said before I have hardly any timebank available to me to think this through. In the end I folded but I’m still not sure how I feel about it.
I would really welcome your views on the hand.
Thanks,
Allan
July 12, 2013
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I probably would have played it the same way. I like the fold. The turn isn't a great card at all for his flop x/r range. NH.
TPE Pro
December 6, 2012
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“I feel like this is one of those miles ahead/miles behind in this spot.”
Yeah, river spots are usually like that 😉
I like the way you played it. Remember that you don't have to solve this kind of spot by figuring out your opponent's range. Often you won't have enough information to decide that, so you can just consider your own range. After you call twice on this runout, AA is pretty close to the bottom of your range. Add to that the fact that many hands you were beating improved on the turn, and that most people don't bluff as much as they should, I wouldn't lose sleep over folding a generic bluff-catcher on the river.
September 14, 2014
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Yeah, folding river seems fine as played. I don't think villian would play a hand like KK this way , probably would had 3-bet this pre , espically from the BB. You don't beat villians value range , your hand is pretty much a bluff catcher and i just don't think villians range is weighted towards bluffs. A lot of hands got there on the turn , would villian play a hand like A9s or k9s like this? i doubt it , so yeah good fold IMO.
January 29, 2014
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Thanks Guys,
I've discussed it with a few others and an interesting spot that was brought up was 3betting the flop? We discussed basically clicking it back/raising super small for 2 reasons. 1) we keep the betting lead on future streets in position 2) we can get to river and possibly showdown without facing another bet, with the raise being smaller than villains likely turn bet.
If we get shoved on flop then it's player dependant, in this case i'd probably fold but against a more agressive player who could tool with A9, 98, TT-KK (trying to trap) its a snap call.
Thanks again for the input
TPE Pro
December 6, 2012
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AlPike said:
Thanks Guys,
I've discussed it with a few others and an interesting spot that was brought up was 3betting the flop? We discussed basically clicking it back/raising super small for 2 reasons. 1) we keep the betting lead on future streets in position 2) we can get to river and possibly showdown without facing another bet, with the raise being smaller than villains likely turn bet.
If we get shoved on flop then it's player dependant, in this case i'd probably fold but against a more agressive player who could tool with A9, 98, TT-KK (trying to trap) its a snap call.
Thanks again for the input
Hate this idea unless you have good reason to believe you can get BB to spaz with top pair.
“The betting lead” is not a real thing. All you're talking about is preventing him from bluffing on future streets, and given that that's all you can beat from many players, that's not a good idea. You should be calling this check-raise with a variety of hands, from draws to weaker made hand/draw combos to overpairs to sets and two-pair. On any given turn, you should fold some of them and call or raise the rest. Rinse and repeat on the river.
Point being, you are supposed to have a folding range. It doesn't indicate that you did anything wrong. Your goal should not be to stop your opponent from successfully bluffing at all costs, nor to make sure you always win the pot when you have an overpair.
If your opponent turns out to be bluffing way too much on this exact runout, there should be plenty of other hands in your range to punish him for that. Most players have, if anything, the opposite problem, and the line you propose is just putting even more money into the pot vs his strongest hands and maybe even setting yourself up to get blown off on the flop (if he jams something like 76 and you fold).
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