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Villain on BTN is the sort of player who is happy to get it in with TPGK i.e. he got it in with QJ on Q high flop deepstacked and is pretty fishy.
Villain in MP2 is more of a TAG player.
My intention here is to check/raise the Turn card.Thoughts?? How do you play it from here? Check/shove???
Poker Stars $3.00+$0.30 No Limit Hold'em Tournament – t250/t500 Blinds + t60 – 8 players
TournamentPokerEdge.com Hand History Converter
MP1: BB = 74.5, t37230
MP2: BB = 38.5, t19241
CO: BB = 46.1, t23047
BTN: BB = 199.7, t99846
SB: BB = 63.8, t31910
BB: BB = 35.3, t17644
UTG: BB = 119.8, t59899
Hero (UTG+1): BB = 53.3, t26658
Pre Flop: (t1230) Hero is UTG+1 with A
A
1 fold, Hero raises to t1155, 1 fold, MP2 calls t1155, 1 fold, BTN calls t1155, 2 folds
Flop: (t4695) 4 8
T (3 players)
Hero bets t2165, MP2 calls t2165, BTN calls t2165
Turn: (t11190) K (3 players)
Hero checks, MP2 bets t2000, BTN raises to t5666, Hero ????
I'm much prefer leading the turn here
but as played i'd probably shove
your turn check showed weakness that either player could easily be trying to capitalise on. also MP villains bet looks weak almost 1/6th pot
if BTN gets it in with TPGK as you said, i'm less worried about him here
with regard to the MP villain, the reason i think it would have been much better to continue barreling the turn is that we would better define his range. ie he's turn raising sets for value, folding his lower pairs, 99 and possibly JJ, and flats his KJ,KQ,AK (if we believe he could float OOP with another player left to act)
as it is when we check and look weak, the MP villain possibly bets some of the hands we just talked about and we dont really get any further info. compounding this is the fact that 'go broke with TP' villain comes over the top
This has ended up being a nasty spot for us. I guess we could flat leaving us a little over 30bb's but we'd be forced to fold if MP comes over the top OR if we're faced with a bet on the river
All in all, our intention was 'check to induce and get it in' – so that's exactly what i'd do.
June 11, 2010
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If the MP player is a competent one like you think he is, I don't think his barrel here is something to be totally freaked out about. From the Preflop action you raised and got two callers so I don't think that Queens or Kings are out there as you didn't see a re-raise and for the most part I would discount JJ as well as it tends to get overplayed in this buy-in level. Based on that I see the two calls as fairly routine as the assumption that you are going to c-bet here virtually all of the time is pretty safe so calling isn't that big a deal to see what you do on the turn. With the check if I am the MP guy I think that there is a pretty good chance that you are giving up on the hand so I can put in a stab and see if I can either take it down or isolate myself with the fish and see if I can gut him depending on my hand. The BTN seems a lot like a scared T to me. Could be KT, QT, JT. I am not sure I buy TT just yet, but it is a possiblility. You said he goes kind of nuts with weak hands so I am tending not to think it is a made set on the flop as he would have gone a little nuttier. You are getting 3:1 on your call here, the real question is the MP player. If you think this is a spot where he could have a legit hand and isn't trying to iso then I think you can fold here as a shove is likely coming here. If you think that this was his attempt to make a move and he will most likely fold it I think you can call. There really are only a few hands that I am really concerned about in his range, (KT, T8, TT, 88 and 44) and like i said above, if your read is right I discount the sets and think this looks a lot more like KT/QT/JT with only one of those having us beat. I would call this and then re-evaluate on the river. A lot of what I would do on the river would depend a lot on the card that peeled.
Id flat and evaluate the river because this is alot of big blinds to put in here when a fair amount of the time were beat.
Agree with the all knowing Canadian 
. We are too strong to fold at this point but we are also not loving this situation. I flat the 3bet and hope MP does not 4bet. If he does 4bet then I fold. Lots of rivers that hurt us as well and I am folding to a big river bet.
In this spot think I disagree with BigDog for the once. By callin the turn we would have put ~1/3 of our stack in the middle. And there are ALOT of scare cards that could come on the river that we could be bluffed on. I'm usually just jammin here, if a draw wants to call w/o proper odds than so be it. If someone has a set or 2 pair than we're probably payin them off on some rivers neway. I'd rather have someone make a bad call and possibly lose a little value than let someone get to the draw cheap here and make a crying call on the river.
October 6, 2010
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i dont think there are that many scare cards except for a Q really.
a third spade doesn't really mean anything in this case because the Ks is out there and the As is in our hand. so as far as draws go, i dont think there are many except QJss
button could definitely have AK here though im not sure why he would raise it now.
looks very much like a set from the button, but i have a hard time folding this.
Why dont we bet the turn here? Makes our decision much easiar and theres no reason we souldnt be looking for value. The hand plays different after this but I fold to any reraise on the turn after leading.
Thanks for all the responses guys!!! Much appreciated!!! Always good to have the minds of the TPE Nation give their thoughts on a hand…… especially the BigDog…!!
Scroll down for the results……….
I felt like the button had picked up a flush draw with something like T
x, I didn't think that MP2 was all that strong, so I decided to go with my hand at this point and deny the draws the proper odds and shove.
Poker Stars $3.00+$0.30 No Limit Hold'em Tournament – t250/t500 Blinds + t60 – 8 players
TournamentPokerEdge.com Hand History Converter
MP1: BB = 74.5, t37230
MP2: BB = 38.5, t19241
CO: BB = 46.1, t23047
BTN: BB = 199.7, t99846
SB: BB = 63.8, t31910
BB: BB = 35.3, t17644
UTG: BB = 119.8, t59899
Hero (UTG+1): BB = 53.3, t26658
Pre Flop: (t1230) Hero is UTG+1 with A A
1 fold, Hero raises to t1155, 1 fold, MP2 calls t1155, 1 fold, BTN calls t1155, 2 folds
Flop: (t4695) 4 8 T (3 players)
Hero bets t2165, MP2 calls t2165, BTN calls t2165
Turn: (t11190) K (3 players)
Hero checks, MP2 bets t2000, BTN raises to t5666, Hero raises to t23278 all in, MP2 folds, BTN calls t17612
River: (t59746) J (2 players – 1 is all in)
Final Pot: t59746
BTN shows 9 7 (a flush, King high)
Hero shows A A (a pair of Aces)
BTN wins t59746
October 6, 2010
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well i wasn't far off with saying QJss. 😀
bad luck though, sometimes you just gotta fade
October 6, 2010
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I think it's pretty important to think about what you're trying to achieve with your cbet. You have AA oop vs 2 players. I think it's crucial to try to win the hand right now (after the flop),
or at least try to get it heads up. Betting 1/2 pot is offering MP about 3-1 to continue. And after he calls, the butt is getting about 4.5-1!
I heard somewhere that the very best players show a profit of only 2 or 3 bbs per hand profit playing AA fr utg.
October 6, 2010
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firstly, we are very definitely betting for value with our cbet.
secondly, i know i play low stakes, but i just filtered my HEM database to AA UTG, and i have had aces from early position 162 times for 1420BBs won, or 8.7bb/hand (out of about 200k hands in total in tourneys)
that would mostly be due to the stakes i think – most people playing $22 tourneys aren't positionally aware.
July 3, 2010
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airedale05 said:
In this spot think I disagree with BigDog for the once. By callin the turn we would have put ~1/3 of our stack in the middle. And there are ALOT of scare cards that could come on the river that we could be bluffed on. I'm usually just jammin here, if a draw wants to call w/o proper odds than so be it. If someone has a set or 2 pair than we're probably payin them off on some rivers neway. I'd rather have someone make a bad call and possibly lose a little value than let someone get to the draw cheap here and make a crying call on the river.
This. The Turn makes it so two draws are now possible so there are a lot of scare cards. And by just calling the Turn we're basically inviting 2 people to outdraw on us.
If you're not checking the Turn to C/R all-in then checking the Turn is pretty bad because now you're actually thinking about folding, flatting, or raising and unable to tell yourself which is best.
MTT poker is about giving yourself the easiest possible decisions on every street of every hand. Anytime you check or bet and can't figure out how to respond to action behind you, you need to ask yourself if there was a different move you could have made where your response would be less difficult.
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