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99 in $215 150K with 25bbs
nocturnal1
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August 19, 2013 - 5:40 am
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I felt like I had a bit much to just 3b shove here so whats the play on this turn should we check shove. He tanked forever leading me to believe he didn't have much and his hud numbers were 13 vpip 11 pfr 87cb 80tcb over a decent sample.  I really hate the idea of 3b folding here would shoving be the best play to someone who seems so solid. I'm thinking the worst play here is to call down both streets and fold on the river. …..g/?6599428

danrose29
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August 19, 2013 - 6:16 am
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this is the problem with flatting 99 with this stack, you have no further idea what he has, his check on the turn could be trap to induce you to put more chips in with worst hand equally maybe he has a high and he doesnt want to two barrell.

If u bet turn and he raises or shoves what do you do? i suppose you could check back turn and hope for safe river to check call or value bet.

nocturnal1
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August 19, 2013 - 4:01 pm
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he didn't ck he bet

hott_mic
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August 19, 2013 - 6:26 pm
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Yeah, tough spot but it got that way from playing it too passively.His min raise preflop looks either scary or weak ,AK AA KK maybe QQ or maybe a hand like A8 suited or small pairs. If you are not RR preflop you could still have redeemed yourself by check raising the flop. Even then he can still be playing A8 like it was the nuts depending on the type of player he is. Agree that check calling the flop/turn then folding the river is the worst, if you think you are good on the flop/turn you should still be good unless an A or K show up then it will be an even harder decison because a lot of hands get there that he is C betting and firing 2 barrels with. If I think I’m good on the turn I’m Reraising then checking the river and re evaluating A turn RR is still a cheaper and better option than … still a tough decision if he bets the river but at least I have more information than if I were to just check call.  If you reraise his 2800 bet to about 7k he is either gonna fire again on the river, check behind you, or fold to your RR, after his bet on the turn and if you were to call the pot would be 10,720 if he fires again you are facing a bet of about 6k if the trend continues… so putting in another 3K or so on the turn make your choices a lot easier IMO. … did this hand run out? Would like to know if he showed.

 

Edit: Didn't realize your stack size. So think it's even more crucial to make up your mind on the flop if you are going hard or folding. Reraising the flop seems like a way better choice.

nocturnal1
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August 20, 2013 - 12:19 am
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ck raising the flop was prbly the way to go but he bet fast so I wanted to see what he would do on the turn and when he tanked so long jamming was the clear play if i'm coolered so be it I did the worst thing possible called down to the river Q and folded lol bad I know

hott_mic
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August 20, 2013 - 12:38 am
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Just curious, what was the river? The replayer doesn't show.

nocturnal1
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August 20, 2013 - 2:41 am
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Queen and he snap shoved I had KQ and AQ in his range really mad at myself for not ck raising turn since the tank showed weakness if I'm beat just swallow it

danrose29
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August 20, 2013 - 2:01 pm
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ive played hands this way so many times and folded to river bet having put in a lot of chips, so maybe betting turn sometimes here is better, i even saw bigdog vs kid cardiff in hand from 109r where bigdog flatted 3 bet pre i think and called to the river which was an ace bigdog had 1010, cardiff had aaa so he was beat all along.

florianm1
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August 20, 2013 - 7:27 pm
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whats his EP raise value?

 

i am  check/shoving flop

 

he has top TP+ only 34.7% if he raises AA-22,AKo-AQo,AKs-AJs (8.6%)

 

and if he raises tighter AA-99,AKo-AQo,AKs-AQs(5.13%) then its only 49.7

 

cheers

Foooka
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August 20, 2013 - 8:07 pm
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With 25bbs and with 99+ I’m sizing my bets to get it in on the flop.. And I honestly feel like a 3bet pre is a must here..

If u 3bet he could only 4bet Shove which I think I’m fist pump snap calling

An if he flats then I jam all flops..

Foooka
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August 20, 2013 - 8:22 pm
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Yeah, tough spot but it got that way from playing it too passively.His min raise preflop looks either scary or weak ,AK AA KK maybe QQ or maybe a hand like A8 suited or small pairs.

 

I don’t agree with the min raise looking strong. At this blind level most compentant players are sizing there bets this way.. When it gets to this level I’m min raising my full range here.. The half pot size bet on the flop I think is standard for all hands that miss this flop.. I think if he had a hand that beats urs he would want to induce u into putting more chips in the pot.. I feel if he indeed hand 10+ his bet sizing would be smaller or even he would check this flop..

I still think 3betting pre and jamming most flops is the way to go here …

hott_mic
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August 26, 2013 - 7:55 pm
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I still think 3betting pre and jamming most flops is the way to go here …

Agreed. I guess I just mean because you’re in the dark on where you stand because most competent players don’t raise depending on the strength of their hands and 3 betting would better define his hand, because he should/could make the same bet pre with AA/kk/QQ ETC. although I think with KQ he folds pre ak or Aq he’s probably getting it in pre and all pairs bigger than 9’s, so 3 betting then reassesing if he shoves is still kind of a tough spot but still way easier than going past the flop on this one. The further in the hand you get the less room you have to play because of your stack size and your options go down.

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