Home
(3 votes) 
May 30, 2012
Offline
Parx BigStax 15 $330 event. Day 1
Hero:(88k) Tourney vet/reg. Lots of deep runs & results. 40 w/m, hoody, hat. Kinda known reg of sorts especially to most of top players.
Villian: (220k) 6x WSOPC winner, w/m 30-35, aggressive, really good. Lots of results. We have played vs each other lots. even last 27 players in tourneys once or twice. He is a great thinking player.
800/1600 200 ante. Hero: just came to table short, but won 2 BIG hands to get it to 88k. Villian is Chip leader at table with over 220k *he’s bossing the table as well. Playing LOTS of hands and winning. The kid is very good.
Villian (UTG 1): OPENS to 3500 from UTG +1.
Hero (BTN): I’m on the button w/ KK, raise to 8k.
Villian: clicks it back make it 18K
Hero: I think about it and make it 29K (59k left) *At this point, it’s after dinner, 3 more levels to go in night till we bag. He’s been in charge of table since I sat. We know each other and I’m kinda trying to talk to him a bit ever now & then. He’s a very quiet player who is there to play poker only. A bit before, he 4bet mini some fish who folded and I didn’t think he was strong. I wasn’t going to let me BS me. He knows I’ll at least fight back. But I have KK…….. I’m not going anywhere.
Villian: Thinks about it for a minute, grabs some chips, drops some, looks nervous when putting in a 6bet to 55k.
Hero: I tank. Felt like him dropping the chips may have been a show.
Question——- Am I ahead? Or does he just have AA in this spot a bunch of times? What do you guys think? Do you ever just flat the 4bet to 18k? Do you fold?
TPE Pro
December 6, 2012
Offline
I sure wouldn’t 5bet-fold. It doesn’t sound like you had a plan when you 5bet, which is a big mistake. Against the described player, seems like a pretty straightforward 5bet-call, but if you think you’re going to have a decision when he shoves, then just call the 4bet.
February 14, 2013
Offline
I think I just shove over the 4bet; I mean I guess u can theoretically be 5bet/f with these stacks but idk, just makes ur hand look really nutty to me, he could potentially puke fold AK or QQ or something…
June 11, 2012
Offline
is he not doing the same with QQ+,AKs and maybe A5s as a pure bluff?
April 30, 2015
Offline
I am not folding KK here. If I lose, I chalk it to a cooler. His light 4-bet though makes it sound like a monster, but only 6 hand combos are ahead, and if that guy is a very good poker player as you suggested, I am not sure he will be playing aces this transparently.
December 30, 2015
Offline
I agree with all above.
A question: What thought process went in to your 5-bet sizing? …It seems small. If it was larger, say $37k, it makes you look committed, even if you did have folds in your plan. I do see some interesting points for a smaller bet too, so I’m curious to hear some thoughts. Perhaps it induced his 5-bet depending on the level he arrived at.
May 30, 2012
Offline
appreciate all the thoughts and feedback guys.
Andrew, I did have a plan. My plan was to DOUBLE up this hand or win lots of chips off of someone. I was hoping someone would flat me or raise me, OTHER THEN THE VILLIAN. It didn’t work out.
My thinking was Kevin (villain) is basically winning lots of hands vs others. Now, I have KK, he opens and I’m going to pounce. Hence the 3bet. Then he surprisingly 4bets to 18k. At this point, I’m like Horrrrreeeeyyyy. Lets GOOOOOOOOOO. It’s only him and I and I’m thinking and thinking and thinking….. too much probably. So I “click” it back, thinking he’s going to jam (All-in) cause he knows how much I have blah blah blah…… He takes some time and goes for chips, looking like he’s nervous and puts out the 5bet. That’s shocked me. I think he was going for a huge stack of 5k chips. Instead he makes the bet 55k. Now I’m thinking, he’s got fucking AA. No other reason why he would do that in my mind. He knows I have to get it in now. Whether I out thought myself I don’t know….. but after about 2 minutes of so, the one player called “CLOCK”. TD comes over and starts. only take about 10 seconds and say “FOLD” and show KK. table seems shocked. Villian looks at me with a look “Reallyyyyy” I have never folded KK to any bet PRE ever. That was a first. I felt that he had AA and nothing else vs me. Without a doubt, he knew he had control of the others, but also knew I could cause some trouble. He and I have been somewhat friendly, but have never spoken at any tourney we have played in. I don’t see him talk to too many players only some bigger regulars
After that, he seems to talk to me someone. We exchanged some private messages via tweeter. He seemed annoyed that he didn’t get all my chips. Said he had AA. One other player confirmed privately that he saw at least one “A” when he put his cards in mock. either way, I felt good about the fold. I’m not folding KK in that spot to most players. There would have to be some sort of dynamic like we had. Otherwise, I would have played it differently vs an rec / amateur types or other well known players who I don’t have much history with.
TPE Pro
December 6, 2012
Offline
P-aire 146 said
appreciate all the thoughts and feedback guys.Andrew, I did have a plan. My plan was to DOUBLE up this hand or win lots of chips off of someone. I was hoping someone would flat me or raise me, OTHER THEN THE VILLIAN. It didn’t work out.
That’s not a plan, that’s just a hope. When you 3bet, the original raiser is BY FAR the person most likely to continue, and you need to think about how you’re going to proceed if he does. More importantly, when you 5-bet, you can’t just be like “Oh crap he 6-bet now what?!” You need to have that thought BEFORE you raise.
It seems like you were intending to call and then freaked out because of his tiny 6-bet. You basically have two choices here:
1. Ignore the sizing and do what you were going to do anyway; or
2. Enter a leveling war. Maybe his sizing means he has exactly AA. Or maybe that’s what he wants you to think, and he has AQ. Or maybe he wants you to think that that’s what he wants you to think…. What I’m getting at is that his sizing doesn’t HAVE to mean anything, even if it does mean something you may not be in a position to figure out what it means, and certainly no one here is in a position to tell you what it means. Generally when you’re up against very good or unknown players, I think it’s best not to try to get into these guessing games at all.
January 20, 2014
Offline
Nice fold man. I don’t know if I could have folded that. But the way you described him, just making that small reraise … good post 🙂
May 30, 2012
Offline
Damn you Andrew……. lol Well said. You are spot on my friend. That 6bet kinda messed with my head some. I thought all along we were just going to get it in. Shame on me. Esp, against a skilled player like Kevin. I do think I out leveled myself here instead of just getting it in on the 5bet or just flatting his 4bet.
My reason for putting this up here was to evoke decision whether GOOD or BAD. I wanted to know how others felt. Plus, as a serious REC player, I am not great at poker. I just want to continue to improve and make GOOD decisions.
I ended up bagging 85k a few levels later and made Day 2. 1st place was 113k. So, at least with this fold I still had a chance at the 1st place prize.
Thanks guys for the feedback.
March 24, 2013
Offline
Foucault said
I sure wouldn’t 5bet-fold. It doesn’t sound like you had a plan when you 5bet, which is a big mistake. Against the described player, seems like a pretty straightforward 5bet-call, but if you think you’re going to have a decision when he shoves, then just call the 4bet.
If OP’s going to be sick to his stomach getting 55 beebs in pre with KK against an aggro guy who has heaps in a $330 mtt, why not just call the 2-bet instead?
TPE Pro
December 6, 2012
Offline
WHO-AM-I said
Foucault said
I sure wouldn’t 5bet-fold. It doesn’t sound like you had a plan when you 5bet, which is a big mistake. Against the described player, seems like a pretty straightforward 5bet-call, but if you think you’re going to have a decision when he shoves, then just call the 4bet.If OP’s going to be sick to his stomach getting 55 beebs in pre with KK against an aggro guy who has heaps in a $330 mtt, why not just call the 2-bet instead?
Because feeling unhappy about a 6-bet doesn’t imply feeling unhappy about a 4-bet (or a call of a 3-bet, or a fold).
May 30, 2012
Offline
It’s easy to say what I should have done from here now……………….
At the table on this specific day vs this specific player……….. right or wrong. Folding after a 6bet pre is what I did.
Hence me wanting to discuss the hand and get your opinions.
I enjoyed reading what everyone has had to say……… thank you again.
Most Users Ever Online: 2780
Currently Online:
42 Guest(s)
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Top Posters:
bennymacca: 2616
Foucault: 2067
folding_aces_pre_yo: 1133
praetor: 1033
theginger45: 924
P-aire 146: 832
Turbulence: 768
The Riceman: 731
duggs: 591
florianm1: 588
Newest Members:
Tillery999
sdmathis89
ne0x00
adrianvaida2525
Anteeater
Laggro
Forum Stats:
Groups: 4
Forums: 24
Topics: 12705
Posts: 75003
Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 1063
Members: 12008
Moderators: 2
Admins: 5
Administrators: RonFezBuddy, Killingbird, Tournament Poker Edge Staff, ttwist, Carlos
Moderators: sitelock, sitelock_1
