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$10,000GTD Awkward river spot with a full house.
Maniackid11
Eating Fish
Balla
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November 11, 2018 - 7:02 pm
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WPN, 750/1,500 blinds, 150 ante No Limit Hold’em Tournament, 9 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager – The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

SB: 8,560 (5.7 bb)
BB: 68,974 (46 bb)
UTG+1: 29,480 (19.7 bb)
UTG+2: 56,086 (37.4 bb)
Hero (MP1): 48,865 (32.6 bb)
MP2: 28,780 (19.2 bb)
MP3: 42,530 (28.4 bb)
CO: 2,530 (1.7 bb)
BTN: 67,010 (44.7 bb)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with T T
2 folds, Hero raises to 3,750, 5 folds, BB calls 2,250

Flop: (9,600) A 8 J (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets 2,400, BB calls 2,400

Turn: (14,400) A (2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks

River: (14,400) A (2 players)
BB bets 62,674 and is all-in, Hero folds

Results:

14,400 pot
Final Board: A 8 J A A
BB mucked and won 14,400 (8,100 net)
Hero mucked T T and lost (-6,300 net)

 

Would you guys fold here?

Foucault

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November 11, 2018 - 7:56 pm
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yes. Among other things, you block busted straight draws, which are most likely bluffs.

Maniackid11
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November 11, 2018 - 8:14 pm
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That would be such a gutsy bluff on the river! Ugh, I’m tilted thinking about it.

**I’m not saying that I think he was bluffing. I’m just commenting on the possibility of “what if”.

rppoker
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November 12, 2018 - 3:22 am
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This feels like our discussion in another thread tonight where the bet sizing by villain was insanely large. It seems like a crazy bet size if he has it and it seems like a crazy bet size if he doesn’t have it. As someone said, you are guessing as to which side of stupid you are dealing with, which made it a fold in people’s minds.

In this thread, if you fold you still have a decent stack size.

A weak ace is certainly a possibility for a BB call preflop. Keep in mind that you are also beat by a J. So while your hand was very good preflop, it is nothing more than a bluff catcher at this point.

Your read on how villain has been playing would help, but do you really want to call off your remaining 28 BBs to his river bet with a bluff catcher? I agree with your fold to his massive shove.

One other question, why are you only betting 25% of the pot on your postflop bet? That is really tiny.

rppoker
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November 12, 2018 - 3:30 am
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Foucault said
yes. Among other things, you block busted straight draws, which are most likely bluffs.  

Andrew, I am curious, if villain had bet 50% of the pot after the turn (7,200 chips rather than the massive shove he executed) would you call? And if villain had bet the pot (14,400 chips) after the turn would you call?

Maniackid11
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November 12, 2018 - 7:04 am
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Ok, ok. I have to work on my bet-sizing. I promise, I will be working on it actively. However, here, I don’t hate the bet-sizing. Mainly because in betting this size, I am happy to pick up the pot on the flop and if we do get called (which we do) I can easily adjust on the turn and river (which I did). I will say, maybe 33% here. But I don’t think in this situation it matters all that much. Actually, I think it might have been the best bet size if cbetting is the best line. Maybe even checking the flop wouldn’t be bad.

I ran this hand in Flopzilla, and I think that I would fold if villain bet anything on the turn and definitely fold if he fires river, regardless of the size.

I ranged villain with a 22% BB defend. This could be a bit more narrow than what might be a standard BB defend range but for conversation sake, I think it’s an ok starting point. So here’s the range I have given the villain:AA-22,AKo-A9o,KQo-KTo,QJo-QTo,JTo,AKs-A4s,KQs-K9s,QJs-Q9s,JTs-J9s,T9s,98s,87s,76s.

On the flop, my hand has very little equity against this range. Being generous, I ranged the villain with a 68% flop calling cbet range, and our hand has only 22% equity against that (Yikes!).

If we narrow his cbet calling range even more to something around 55%, our equity drops 50% leaving us with 11% equity vs his flop calling range. And I think I am being generous by giving him a 55% calling range. It’s probably closer to 40%. Our equity remains at 11% either way.

By the river, our equity is still 11%, which now makes me think this could have been a bluff, if it was, good for him. But either way, we can not call. unless the villain makes a min-bet here, I think we fold every time.

almofadinhas
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November 15, 2018 - 5:24 pm
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I would not cbet that flop

I would not give V top of range (JJ+AQ+), since V probably 3bets pre flop to GII

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