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May 26, 2010
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Villian's your typical LAG (30/23 over 50 hands) with a very high 3-bet % of 26. (small sample size I know)
We are 50bb's deep and 37 effective so i'm not 4-bet getting it in here pre-flop (or am I)? To me shipping this many bb's seems like a bad idea, so my options are to flat and play OOP or fold IMO. Also my read was that he did not have an over pair considering his image and recent activity levels at the table.
How do you proceed post flop? Do we just jam and get it in and try to take the play away from him? I remember feeling like this flop was pretty bad for me and basically said to myself that i'll roll the dice here. I could not come up with a range for him since he was such a LAG player.
Full Tilt Poker $10,000 Rush Guar (Rebuy) No Limit Hold'em Tournament – t2000/t4000 Blinds + t500 – 9 players
TournamentPokerEdge.com Hand History Converter
daleys1622 (BTN): BB = 37.8, t151049
ducebagg83 (SB): BB = 183.4, t733728
DiamondsGuy (BB): BB = 41.7, t166939
CalShark1 (UTG): BB = 49.5, t198153
Metasploit (UTG+1): BB = 50.6, t202564
aclark1804 (UTG+2): BB = 59.3, t237130
Chriz858 (MP1): BB = 16.0, t63932
gabri2012 (MP2): BB = 166.4, t665795
Giddy Up Again (CO): BB = 85.4, t341433
Pre Flop: (t10500) Metasploit is UTG+1 with T
T
1 fold, Metasploit raises to t11000, 4 folds, daleys1622 raises to t38000, 2 folds, Metasploit calls t27000
Flop: (t86500) J
8
9 (2 players)
Metasploit checks, daleys1622 bets t54000, Metasploit requests TIME, Metasploit raises to t164064 all in, daleys1622 calls t58549 all in
Turn: (t311598) 4 (2 players – 2 are all in)
River: (t311598) 5 (2 players – 2 are all in)
I think stacks are pretty good for a 4bet shove, he’s committed a quarter of his stack already. His range is pretty light 50hands isn’t too bad a sample size. You’ll take it down maybe 80%+ times and when he does call with a range of JJ+ and AK, your still 33%. put him to a decision I don’t like flatting to play oop with these stacks coz it sucks when any overcards fall and smack his 3betting range.
If youre using HEM I would click the 3bet% number on the hud. you should get a pop showing the positions he’s 3betting from. If you see he’s 3betting the button often then it makes shipping easier.
Has he been consistently raising this much when he 3bets? His stats indicate that this is a shove – the only thing that is scaring me is the size of his 3-bet. If it isn't consistant with the other ones, I fold. if it is consistant and he's just a complete spewtard, then I shove.
Also depends on where he was 3betting from. If he is 3-betting from the sb against button raises all the time, and all of a sudden is 3-betting your UTG raise, that's something to consider, too.
May 26, 2010
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The size of his 3-bet worried me alot also as it just felt like he was commiting to much of his stack for it to be a bluff or a really light 3-bet.
I use Poker CoPilot and it does not give me a break down of his 3-bets in various positions (but his Fold to 3Bet % was 100%, 4/4 or 5/5 if memory serves correct). I think this is just one of those situations where a LAG actually woke with a hand.
Great point regarding WHERE he was 3-betting from and his bet size when doing so. Those are things I did not consider. Thanks Wein and everyone else for taking the time to reply, I appreciate it.
Cheers
Other information I think is important: How often have you been opening? Has he 3 bet you before? Have you folded to a 3 bet before? His or others?
Doesn't really look like villain's folding here anymore or it's a ballsy “strong looking” 3bet. I'd prolly fold and preserve my chips here. Don't think you're better than flipping. The % you're actually a 70/30 or 80/20 favourite here look pretty slim.
Also, raise less pre. Mine would be 8789ish.
May 26, 2010
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Thinking back on the hand, I felt that his 3-bet was pretty big and comitting but I did not go with my gut instinct. I still don't see how I can fold pre here so I guess this spots a 4-bet shove.
I was raising on the bigger side in this tournament and at this particular table to get more value from my big hands. This was a 10K 1 dollar rush rebuy so the players are pretty awful and are always flatting opens so why not raise bigger with your premium hands and really punish them for playing to many hands and calling to many opens, especially UTG+1 opens.
Metasploit said:
Villian's your typical LAG (30/23 over 50 hands) with a very high 3-bet % of 26. (small sample size I know)
We are 50bb's deep and 37 effective so i'm not 4-bet getting it in here pre-flop (or am I)? To me shipping this many bb's seems like a bad idea, so my options are to flat and play OOP or fold IMO. Also my read was that he did not have an over pair considering his image and recent activity levels at the table.
How do you proceed post flop? Do we just jam and get it in and try to take the play away from him? I remember feeling like this flop was pretty bad for me and basically said to myself that i'll roll the dice here. I could not come up with a range for him since he was such a LAG player.
Full Tilt Poker $10,000 Rush Guar (Rebuy) No Limit Hold'em Tournament – t2000/t4000 Blinds + t500 – 9 players
TournamentPokerEdge.com Hand History Converter
daleys1622 (BTN): BB = 37.8, t151049
ducebagg83 (SB): BB = 183.4, t733728
DiamondsGuy (BB): BB = 41.7, t166939
CalShark1 (UTG): BB = 49.5, t198153
Metasploit (UTG+1): BB = 50.6, t202564
aclark1804 (UTG+2): BB = 59.3, t237130
Chriz858 (MP1): BB = 16.0, t63932
gabri2012 (MP2): BB = 166.4, t665795
Giddy Up Again (CO): BB = 85.4, t341433
Pre Flop: (t10500) Metasploit is UTG+1 with T
1 fold, Metasploit raises to t11000, 4 folds, daleys1622 raises to t38000, 2 folds, Metasploit calls t27000
Flop: (t86500) J
Metasploit checks, daleys1622 bets t54000, Metasploit requests TIME, Metasploit raises to t164064 all in, daleys1622 calls t58549 all in
Turn: (t311598) 4
River: (t311598) 5
you have no history with this guy? has to be a fold preflop his sizing is huge. your raise size is also too big. 2.5x at max please
May 26, 2010
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I'll correct my bet sizing. Normally my raise sizing is pretty spot on with what the pros teach here but this was an exception. Thanks for the input guys. I need to be more disciplined when I get 3-bet with a 'premium' and actually find a way to fold sometimes.
Question – Am I supposed to disregard his HUD stats then? The guys a LAG (30/23), whos 3-betting me on the button, with a 3B% of 26% (only 50 hand sample though) with a Fold to 3Bet (F3B) of 100% 4/4 or 5/5 can't remember…?
50 hands doesnt mean anything pay attention to the table not his sstats
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